Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1T5YCKI8Y000H3T@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:53 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.175]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from modem-21.red-naped-sapsucker.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.208.21] helo=vaio) by cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14j3rp-00078t-00 for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 19:43:26 +0100 Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 19:52:03 +0100 From: Mark Turner Subject: Re: W-EMED PJs Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001701c0b94a$9cb4ffc0$15d0893e@vaio> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: <3b.1282e09b.27f50704@aol.com> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable So far 4 PJs from the 321st Special Tactics Squadron baised at RAF = Mildenhall, England, have done the WEMT course which we have run in = Britain. We are running another course this year and they have been in = contact regarding sending PJs on it. Best regards Mark Turner Combat Medical Technician RAMC Eqt & logistics Officer European Faculty WEMSI ----- Original Message -----=20 From: DCLinn@aol.com=20 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 10:45 PM Subject: W-EMED PJs Yes Bob a lot has changed in military medicine since Korea, given the=20 advances in medicine and SAR. Furthermore, the battlefield is much = different=20 today, and today's media gives folks at home a clear view of = casualties. From=20 an American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get=20 "clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and far = from=20 definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting of = multiple=20 low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at risk of = getting=20 "clobbered" are the pilots and special operators. When they get = "clobbered",=20 search and rescue usually becomes paramount. Advances in media, = especially=20 television, mean that public opinion will no longer tolerate even = small=20 numbers of casualties, and just one fatality can be a political = disaster.=20 So great advances have been made in the ability to extract the injured = from=20 remote "battlefields", quickly project definitive salvage trauma care = to=20 remote locations, and then fly critically injured patients long = distances to=20 tertiary care medical centers. The US military will go to great = expense and=20 effort to save even one life these days.=20 The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of the Air = Force. =20 They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is much more = wilderness=20 medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info about pararescue = can be=20 found on the web site www.pararescue.com .=20 IDMTs are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician=20 extenders to remote locations where people are stationed or training = and no=20 physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and are=20 authorized to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are also = trained to=20 recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and evacuate that = person to=20 definitive care. However, with the exception a few special IDMTs, = they=20 don't do much SAR or wilderness medicine. The PJ job would be much = more=20 interesting to most of the users of this forum.=20 David Linn, MD=20 Emergency Physician and EMS Director=20 WPAFB, OH=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
So far 4 PJs from the 321st Special = Tactics=20 Squadron baised at RAF Mildenhall, England, have done the WEMT = course which=20 we have run in Britain.  We are running another course this year = and they=20 have been in contact regarding sending PJs on it.
 
 
Best regards
 
Mark Turner
Combat Medical Technician
RAMC
Eqt & logistics Officer European = Faculty=20 WEMSI
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 DCLinn@aol.com
To: wilderness-emergency-= medicine@list.pitt.edu=20
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 = 10:45=20 PM
Subject: W-EMED PJs

Yes Bob a = lot has=20 changed in military medicine since Korea, given the
advances in = medicine=20 and SAR. Furthermore, the  battlefield is much different =
today, and=20 today's media gives folks at home a clear view of casualties. From =
an=20 American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get=20
"clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and = far=20 from
definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting = of=20 multiple
low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at = risk of=20 getting
"clobbered" are the pilots and special operators. =  When they=20 get "clobbered",
search and rescue usually becomes paramount. = Advances in=20 media, especially
television, mean that public opinion will no = longer=20 tolerate even small
numbers of casualties, and just one fatality = can be a=20 political disaster.

So great advances have been made in the = ability to=20 extract the injured from
remote "battlefields", quickly project = definitive=20 salvage trauma care to
remote locations, and then fly critically = injured=20 patients long distances to
tertiary care medical centers. The US = military=20 will go to great expense and
effort to save even one life these = days.=20

The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of = the Air=20 Force.  
They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is = much more=20 wilderness
medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info = about=20 pararescue can be
found on the web site www.pararescue.com . =

IDMTs=20 are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician =
extenders=20 to remote locations where people are stationed or training and no=20
physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and = are=20
authorized  to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are = also=20 trained to
recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and = evacuate=20 that person to
definitive care.  However, with the exception = a few=20 special IDMTs,  they
don't do much SAR or wilderness = medicine.=20  The PJ job would be much more
interesting to most of the = users of=20 this forum.

David Linn, MD
Emergency Physician and EMS = Director=20
WPAFB, OH ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:06:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1SWATCLJ4000D5U@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:06:50 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:04:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m04.mx.aol.com (imo-m04.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.7]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:04:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.14.) id h.5b.13f7c0e4 (4565) for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:03:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:03:58 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Medics & Up to speed Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are NREMT-Bs and treat all patients equally at the EMT-B level but they do start IVs which in New Jersey we do not as New Jersey EMT-Bs. They operate inder a more "national protocol". Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are NREMT-Bs and treat all patients equally at the EMT-B
level but they do start IVs which in New Jersey we do not as New Jersey
EMT-Bs.  They operate inder a more "national protocol".

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1RY3GE1K600S0HD@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:47:22 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:46:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m10.mx.aol.com (imo-m10.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.165]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:46:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from DCLinn@aol.com by imo-m10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.14.) id h.3b.1282e09b (3874) for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:45:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:45:40 -0500 (EST) From: DCLinn@aol.com Subject: W-EMED PJs Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3b.1282e09b.27f50704@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10501 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes Bob a lot has changed in military medicine since Korea, given the advances in medicine and SAR. Furthermore, the battlefield is much different today, and today's media gives folks at home a clear view of casualties. From an American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get "clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and far from definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting of multiple low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at risk of getting "clobbered" are the pilots and special operators. When they get "clobbered", search and rescue usually becomes paramount. Advances in media, especially television, mean that public opinion will no longer tolerate even small numbers of casualties, and just one fatality can be a political disaster. So great advances have been made in the ability to extract the injured from remote "battlefields", quickly project definitive salvage trauma care to remote locations, and then fly critically injured patients long distances to tertiary care medical centers. The US military will go to great expense and effort to save even one life these days. The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of the Air Force. They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is much more wilderness medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info about pararescue can be found on the web site www.pararescue.com . IDMTs are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician extenders to remote locations where people are stationed or training and no physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and are authorized to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are also trained to recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and evacuate that person to definitive care. However, with the exception a few special IDMTs, they don't do much SAR or wilderness medicine. The PJ job would be much more interesting to most of the users of this forum. David Linn, MD Emergency Physician and EMS Director WPAFB, OH --part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes Bob a lot has changed in military medicine since Korea, given the
advances in medicine and SAR. Furthermore, the  battlefield is much different
today, and today's media gives folks at home a clear view of casualties. From
an American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get
"clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and far from
definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting of multiple
low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at risk of getting
"clobbered" are the pilots and special operators.  When they get "clobbered",
search and rescue usually becomes paramount. Advances in media, especially
television, mean that public opinion will no longer tolerate even small
numbers of casualties, and just one fatality can be a political disaster.

So great advances have been made in the ability to extract the injured from
remote "battlefields", quickly project definitive salvage trauma care to
remote locations, and then fly critically injured patients long distances to
tertiary care medical centers. The US military will go to great expense and
effort to save even one life these days.

The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of the Air Force.  
They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is much more wilderness
medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info about pararescue can be
found on the web site www.pararescue.com .

IDMTs are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician
extenders to remote locations where people are stationed or training and no
physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and are
authorized  to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are also trained to
recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and evacuate that person to
definitive care.  However, with the exception a few special IDMTs,  they
don't do much SAR or wilderness medicine.  The PJ job would be much more
interesting to most of the users of this forum.

David Linn, MD
Emergency Physician and EMS Director
WPAFB, OH --part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:03:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1QSQ5T6H800RFUJ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:03:05 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:02:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from briseis.worthy.com (root@cpe-bworthy-56kbrstbl.wireless.mt.net [206.127.112.30]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:02:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from worthy.com ([206.127.79.66]) by briseis.worthy.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id TAA06001 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:23:02 -0700 Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:06:58 -0700 From: Bob Worthy Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3AC298C2.979E5355@worthy.com> Organization: Key Computer Consultants, Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-Accept-Language: en References: <33.12ad34c1.27f367c1@aol.com> Along this topic, I thought this might be of interest. At a used book sale recently I bought _Back Down the Ridge_, W.L. White, 1953, Harcourt, Brace and Company, 182 pages. The jacket blurb says, "The story of what happens to the men who get "clobbered" in Korea." This is a very well written book, very informative. Author's Note Ch 1: How you get Clobbered Ch 2: Down Off the Ridge Ch 3: Your Litter Goes Through a Mash Ch 4: So They Open You Up Ch 5: The Valley of the Shadow Ch 6: Headed State-Side Ch 7: The Enemy and Our Allies: A Litter-Level View Ch 8: So Now you Limp Off Epilogue: The Next Wave It would be interesting to hear how much has changed since 1953. It would appear that huge advances were made in Korea in battlefield care. -- Bob Worthy bworthy@worthy.com http://www.worthy.com/ 406 439 0986 v See Lewis and Clark SAR new http://www.lcsar.com/ Visit new searchable index on Search and Rescue, http://www.worthy.com/sarsearch/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1QQ9IQH8O00S0DN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:52:24 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:51:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from web6303.mail.yahoo.com (web6303.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.22.140]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:51:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from [165.76.25.94] by web6303.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:51:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:51:48 -0800 (PST) From: Trevor Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: <20010327204923.61686.qmail@web9601.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010329005148.10078.qmail@web6303.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk Some have been certified as EMT-P but we are only required to be EMT-B --- Morgan Young wrote: > are they NREMT-Paramedic certified or other? > > > --- Trevor wrote: > > IDMT's are required to see patients at least once a > > quarter and attend refresher courses > > annually. Most work in ERs or in other patient care > > areas. All are also NREMT > > certified. We attend conferences and workshops like > > other medical professionals. We > > just work in a different spectrum when we are > > deployed. We just dont get paid as well as > > "Medical Professionals" > > > > Trevor J Correia, SSgt, USAF, IDMT > > Yokota Search and Rescue Instuctor > > > > > > --- Andy wrote: > > > This has piqued my interest. > > > > > > By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and > > IDC's > > > get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How > > do > > > they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice > > > during deployments? > > > > > > Andy Thornton > > > > > > > > > Do not reproduce without author's express > > permission. > > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > > > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > > > Submissions To: > > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > > Do not reproduce without author's express > > permission. > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > > Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > > ===== > Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P > theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address > My ICQ Number is13139183. > The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. > -Joseph Heller > "If your going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1Q86QMWJK00S0DN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:46 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com (imo-m03.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from GaidenMstr@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.33.12ad34c1 (9251) for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:13:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:13:53 -0500 (EST) From: GaidenMstr@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <33.12ad34c1.27f367c1@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10519 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ladies and Gentlemen, The primary purpose of the Independent Duty Corpsman (IDC), Independent Duty Medical Technician (IDMT) and the Special Forces Medical Sergeant (SFMS also known as an 18D) are to care for military personnel at remote sites. Some of these same independent duty medics have to be able treat and try to keep the patients stabilized for up to 72 hours before they can be evacuated from their site (ship, remote fixed site or in the middle of a jungle). These personnel must also be able to provide primary clinical care, public health/ preventive health services, and emergency dental care. One could not truely categorize them as just EMTs but rather non-traditional healthcare clinicians; furthermore, they are much more different than the basic military medic as described by an individual in earlier posting. If one was to describe the duties of the general populace, he or she would have to say that these individuals are public health technicians, intermediate to advanced nurses, primary care clinicians, and EMT-Intermediate to EMT-Paramedics. You could say that they are a jack-of-all-trades with some of them certified as NREMT basics through paramedic levels; however, just because they are EMT-Basics doesn't mean that they function at that level becuase they function at a higher level to include ACLS roles. Well, I have been on my soap box long enough and will close. If you any of you non-military medics want to talk more about this without holding up other forum posts please feel free to talk to me offline. Take care. Robert A. McCumsey Robert A. McCumsey MSgt, USAF IDMT, EMT-P NCOIC, Joint SOF Medical Education & Training Division U.S. Special Operations Command/ SOCS-SG 7701 Tampa Point Blvd MacDill AFB, FL 33621 Telephone: (813) 828-5043 Fax: (813) 828-2568 --part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ladies and Gentlemen,

      The primary purpose of the Independent Duty Corpsman (IDC),
Independent Duty Medical Technician (IDMT) and the Special Forces Medical
Sergeant (SFMS also known as an 18D) are to care for military personnel at
remote sites.  Some of these same independent duty medics have to be able
treat and try to keep the patients stabilized for up to 72 hours before they
can be evacuated from their site (ship, remote fixed site or in the middle of
a jungle).  These personnel must also be able to provide primary clinical
care, public health/ preventive health services,  and emergency dental care.  
One could not truely categorize them as just EMTs but rather non-traditional
healthcare clinicians; furthermore, they are much more different than the
basic military medic as described by an individual in earlier posting.

      If one was to describe the duties of the general populace, he or she
would have to say that these individuals are public health technicians,
intermediate to advanced nurses, primary care clinicians, and
EMT-Intermediate to EMT-Paramedics.  You could say that they are a
jack-of-all-trades with some of them certified as NREMT basics through
paramedic levels; however, just because they are EMT-Basics doesn't mean that
they function at that level becuase they function at a higher level to
include ACLS roles.  

      Well, I have been on my soap box long enough and will close.  If you
any of you non-military medics want to talk more about this without holding
up other forum posts please feel free to talk to me offline.  Take care.


Robert A. McCumsey
Robert A. McCumsey
MSgt, USAF
IDMT, EMT-P
NCOIC, Joint SOF Medical Education & Training Division
U.S. Special Operations Command/ SOCS-SG

7701 Tampa Point Blvd
MacDill AFB, FL 33621

Telephone: (813) 828-5043
Fax: (813) 828-2568 --part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1Q80I8R6S0004NO@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:44 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp5vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.26]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron (adsl-141-151-143-199.pittpa.adsl.bellatlantic.net [141.151.143.199]) by smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA18427529 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:16:49 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:22 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: W-EMED subscriber information Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3AC1C662.12520.543A09@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Information for W-EMED subscribers can be found on the Web at: http://www.pitt.edu/~postman/lists/majordomo-basic.html Thank you. --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1Q80LVVR600RSH0@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:49 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp5vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.26]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron (adsl-141-151-143-199.pittpa.adsl.bellatlantic.net [141.151.143.199]) by smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA16795436 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:16:50 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:05:13 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: W-EMED reminder -- restricted posting Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3AC1C569.11454.506B74@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk As of a few days ago, only those email addresses actually s u b s c r i b e d to the list can post to the list. This will not eliminate spam -- someone can join and post spam (although I will delete them from the list). However, it should cut down on the spam quite a bit. If you find that you need to post from another address than that under which you're s u b s c r i b e d, please s u b s c r i b e that other address, too. Thank you --Keith Conover, listowner --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:44:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1PBNUJS8O0004SK@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:44:03 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:43:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.memlane.com (mail.memlane.com [199.185.225.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from name ([199.185.225.226]) by mail.memlane.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-55152U3000L300S0V35) with SMTP id com for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 17:42:46 -0700 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 17:37:42 -0700 From: Donovan Hoggan Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000b01c0b71f$4de81b20$e2e1b9c7@name> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello again, I just wanted to thank everyone for the overwhelming response to my = question. I still need to consult with the rest of the team, but I = think we're going to include NP airways in the kit. Thanks again. Donovan Hoggan ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello = again,
 
I just wanted to = thank everyone=20 for the overwhelming response to my question.  I still need to = consult=20 with the rest of the team, but I think we're going to include NP = airways in=20 the kit.
 
Thanks = again.
 
Donovan=20 Hoggan
------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1P3KH34A800PZUO@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:16 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from web9609.mail.yahoo.com (web9609.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.188]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from [205.182.107.178] by web9609.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:52:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:52:02 -0800 (PST) From: Morgan Young Subject: Re: W-EMED Is there a Digest In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010327205202.15726.qmail@web9609.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk I wish, but this is the most traffic I have seen on this list. --- TANMAN wrote: > Is there a Digest form for Wilderness Medicine? > > And can you give the instructions? > > Thanks, > > > > Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email > > Albuquerque, New Mexico > __________________________________________________________________ > > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu ===== Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address My ICQ Number is13139183. The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. -Joseph Heller "If your going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1P3HKR53O0004SH@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:56 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from web9601.mail.yahoo.com (web9601.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.180]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from [205.182.107.178] by web9601.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:49:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:49:23 -0800 (PST) From: Morgan Young Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: <20010327090215.9042.qmail@web6301.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010327204923.61686.qmail@web9601.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk are they NREMT-Paramedic certified or other? --- Trevor wrote: > IDMT's are required to see patients at least once a > quarter and attend refresher courses > annually. Most work in ERs or in other patient care > areas. All are also NREMT > certified. We attend conferences and workshops like > other medical professionals. We > just work in a different spectrum when we are > deployed. We just dont get paid as well as > "Medical Professionals" > > Trevor J Correia, SSgt, USAF, IDMT > Yokota Search and Rescue Instuctor > > > --- Andy wrote: > > This has piqued my interest. > > > > By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and > IDC's > > get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How > do > > they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice > > during deployments? > > > > Andy Thornton > > > > > > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > > Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu ===== Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address My ICQ Number is13139183. The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. -Joseph Heller "If your going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:45:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OSUR29JG0004SC@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:45:12 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:45:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from inago.swcp.com (inago.swcp.com [198.59.115.17]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:44:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (tanman@localhost) by inago.swcp.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA24084 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:38:28 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:38:28 -0700 (MST) From: TANMAN Subject: W-EMED Is there a Digest In-reply-to: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC38D@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: inago.swcp.com: tanman owned process doing -bs Is there a Digest form for Wilderness Medicine? And can you give the instructions? Thanks, Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email Albuquerque, New Mexico __________________________________________________________________ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OS2BHC3400PZUO@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:22:17 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:21:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:21:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2RF8x726660 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2RF8xZ26656 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:15:12 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:23:42 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: W-EMED Medics & Up to speed Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC38D@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk Andy, Military medics are allowed to work on us Military (Folks in Uniform) stateside and overseas during military training exercises IAW Military Protocols but not treat civilians (folks out of Uniforms) the same way or protocols. So if both my wife and I get in a car wreck on base they can treat me IAW Military Protocols and the wife through EMT-B/P protocols depending on the certification of the crew. The Army now requires its medics to complete and test out as EMT-Bs through National Registry. I took my EMT-B course though the Army, I am Field Artillery not Medical, I had an easier time with the course than the Medics and Corpsmen because they use to doing military combat protocols vs. civilians on the street and were always commenting why can't I tube that chest to reduce the sucking chest wound. The Army has a training program to provide every squad with one combat life saver. That soldier is trained in advanced first aid and starting an IV. They carry a combat life saver bag with IV during all training & deployments. So you have infantrymen, artillerymen, tankers to truck drivers and admin clerks who can start IVs and provide fluids. I believe this came about after the Falklands War which showed us (US Army) getting an IV started & fluids on board early help save lives. Different rules for different environments, kinda like WEMS vs. Street EMS. Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Andy [mailto:brannen@lookingglass.net] Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 8:47 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's This has piqued my interest. By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice during deployments? Andy Thornton Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1ONGH5LC600PZUO@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:55 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp018.mail.yahoo.com (smtp018.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.115]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo109.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.145) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 13:10:34 +0000 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:10:29 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000001c0b6bf$4bc53cc0$916bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just for the record, I am not, and was not an IDC. But I did time as a combat medic with USMC. I am not a Marine, but I was in the USMC. Hard to explain to someone that has not been around USN/USMC. The Navy Corpsman (what they are really called) are kind of a combination of CNA & EMT-I. The Corpsman can intubate, do IV's and do Chest Tubes if needed in Combat to Marines or Sailors, but NOT to civilians. Corpsman also see Pts at Sick call, but their charts have to be reviewed by a Doctor, just like QI. They take care of the cold and the flu, and other small Family Practice stuff, it is More than they can handle themselves, they send them for a consult with the Doctor, who may be able to handle it, or send it on to a internist, or other "specialist". There is no clear cut guidelines on what a Corpsman can see, and what he has to send to the Doctor. Notice I am not calling the doctor "Doc" in the USN/USMC the Corpsman are called Doc, the Doctor is called "Sir", or "Ma'am" Anyway what a Corpsman can see, and can not see, is worked out between the Doctor and the Corpsman, based on the corpsmans Education, and the Doctor's comfort with the corpsman. Corpsman also work on the wards in Military hospitals, doing much the same type of stuff, under the supervision of BSN's. They do alot of Nursing stuff, and many skills. Being a Corpsman really prepared me for being a Paramedic. the big diffrence between Corpsman and Paramedic's is the Cardiac, ACLS, and Pharmicological aspects of being a Paramedic. Corpsman aren't allowed to give Drugs to Pt.s via IVP. They are only allowed to Rx stuff with a doctors actual co-signature on the Rx slip. oh yeah and the 2nd big diffrence between Corpsman and a Paramedic, 90% of a corpsman's Pt's are 18 to 20 years old, Run 3 miles in 18 minutes 5 days a week, and have no Cardiac History. this is just a broad overview, as I see it, and having been both a Navy Corpsman, and a Paramedic. Both are wonderful Jobs. -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of LNMolino@aol.com Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 22:41 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's At McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical under military doctors regularly. They actually see patients just as if they were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics training. I'll ask in the AM. BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I am a civilian contractor at McGuire not a member of the USAF. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just=20 for the record, I am not, and was not an IDC.   But I did time = as a=20 combat medic with USMC.  I am not a Marine, but I was in the = USMC. =20 Hard to explain to someone that has not been around USN/USMC.  The = Navy=20 Corpsman (what they are really called) are kind of a combination of CNA = &=20 EMT-I.  The Corpsman can intubate, do IV's and do Chest Tubes if = needed in=20 Combat to Marines or Sailors, but NOT to civilians.
Corpsman also see Pts at Sick call, but their charts have to be = reviewed=20 by a Doctor, just like QI.  They take care of the cold and the flu, = and=20 other small Family Practice stuff, it is More than they can handle = themselves,=20 they send them for a consult with the Doctor, who may be able to handle = it, or=20 send it on to a internist, or other "specialist".  =
There=20 is no clear cut guidelines on what a Corpsman can see, and what he has = to send=20 to the Doctor.  Notice I am not calling the doctor "Doc" in the = USN/USMC=20 the Corpsman are called Doc, the Doctor is called "Sir", or = "Ma'am"  Anyway=20 what a Corpsman can see, and can not see, is worked out between the = Doctor and=20 the Corpsman, based on the corpsmans Education, and the Doctor's comfort = with=20 the corpsman. 
Corpsman also work on the wards in Military hospitals, doing = much the=20 same type of stuff, under the supervision of BSN's.  They do alot = of=20 Nursing stuff, and many skills. 
Being=20 a Corpsman really prepared me for being a Paramedic.  the big = diffrence=20 between Corpsman and Paramedic's is the Cardiac, ACLS, and = Pharmicological=20 aspects of being a Paramedic.  Corpsman aren't allowed to give = Drugs to=20 Pt.s via IVP.  They are only allowed to Rx stuff with a doctors = actual=20 co-signature on the Rx slip.  oh yeah and the 2nd big diffrence = between=20 Corpsman and a Paramedic, 90% of a corpsman's Pt's are 18 to 20 years = old, Run 3=20 miles in 18 minutes 5 days a week, and have no Cardiac=20 History.
this=20 is just a broad overview, as I see it, and having been both a Navy = Corpsman, and=20 a Paramedic.
Both=20 are wonderful Jobs.
 
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf = Of=20 LNMolino@aol.com
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 = 22:41
To:=20 wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: = W-EMED IDMT's=20 & IDC's

At=20 McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical =
under=20 military doctors regularly.  They actually see patients just as if = they=20
were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics = training.=20
I'll ask in the AM.

BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I = am a=20 civilian contractor at McGuire
not a member of the USAF. =

Louis N.=20 Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com =

New=20 Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions = stated here=20 are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the = opinions of=20 any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless = otherwise=20 stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0-- _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- X-cs: R From: Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP X-RS-ID: X-RS-Flags: 0,0,1,1,0,0,0 X-RS-Sigset: 2 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: reminder -- list posting restricted Reply-to: kconover@pitt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:24:53 -0500 A brief reminder. Posting to the list is now restricted to members -- to cut down on spam. AND, members may only post from the address under which they are s u b s c r i b e d. You may, however, s u b s c r i b e under multiple addresses to allow you to post from multiple addresses. Thank you. -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OLLSZIMG0004SH@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from darlington.k12.sc.us ([207.232.247.130]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from INTERNET-Message_Server by darlington.k12.sc.us with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:12:50 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:12:24 -0500 From: Dan Plemons Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu id HAA02583 X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-disposition: inline Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk On another subject.....What do you guys use for training for working with Hispanic victims? I need some good sources..... Dan >>> brannen@lookingglass.net Monday, March 26, 2001 >>> This has piqued my interest. By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice during deployments? Andy Thornton Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OESTQUJQ00RNSZ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from web6301.mail.yahoo.com (web6301.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.22.138]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from [165.76.25.85] by web6301.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 01:02:15 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 01:02:15 -0800 (PST) From: Trevor Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: <3ABFF0F7.310BCD02@lookingglass.net> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010327090215.9042.qmail@web6301.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk IDMT's are required to see patients at least once a quarter and attend refresher courses annually. Most work in ERs or in other patient care areas. All are also NREMT certified. We attend conferences and workshops like other medical professionals. We just work in a different spectrum when we are deployed. We just dont get paid as well as "Medical Professionals" Trevor J Correia, SSgt, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instuctor --- Andy wrote: > This has piqued my interest. > > By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's > get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do > they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice > during deployments? > > Andy Thornton > > > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:42:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1O5OUR4W800P5Q9@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:42:16 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r13.mx.aol.com (imo-r13.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.67]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-r13.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.f6.8753a4b (4564) for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:14 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:14 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical under military doctors regularly. They actually see patients just as if they were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics training. I'll ask in the AM. BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I am a civilian contractor at McGuire not a member of the USAF. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical
under military doctors regularly.  They actually see patients just as if they
were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics training.
I'll ask in the AM.

BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I am a civilian contractor at McGuire
not a member of the USAF.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1NZHX0OHW00RNSZ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:53 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.trailnet.com (mail.trailnet.com [63.71.68.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from lookingglass.net ([207.18.213.53]) by mail.trailnet.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-60892U4000L400S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 18:55:50 -0700 Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 18:46:31 -0700 From: Andy Subject: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3ABFF0F7.310BCD02@lookingglass.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-Accept-Language: en References: <000201c0b657$bb569ec0$ab6bb6cd@morgan> This has piqued my interest. By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice during deployments? Andy Thornton Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:50:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1NXL9TSI600R03I@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:50:19 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:49:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp016.mail.yahoo.com (smtp016.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.113]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:49:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo083.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.171) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 00:49:14 +0000 Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 18:49:08 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <43.12868ac2.27eee033@aol.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000201c0b657$bb569ec0$ab6bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Navy has a simillar program, except they are called IDC (Independant Duty Corpsman) The most notable is the Sub IDC's they are the only "Doc" on a sub. There are many diffrent areas of the Navy that Corpsman (similar to a Medic, but not) serve, including the Marine Corps (where I served) and their is a diffrent flavor of IDC for each area that you are in. Everything from Subs, to Special Forces (Seals, and Force Recon) To small ships. and simillarly they are not allowed to do as near as much in the US, as they are at Sea. To Bad. -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of LNMolino@aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 23:46 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician. They have a slew of training but can't operate unless deployed but then again they "see patients" in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians Assistant. They can write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active duty people and only when filled in a military pharmacy and other things that are WELL beyond any civilian scope of practice. When deployed on missions out of the US they are often the "doc" for the mission and act accordingly. The USAF only has about 3350 active IDMTs at any one time. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The=20 Navy has a simillar program, except they are called IDC (Independant = Duty=20 Corpsman) 
The=20 most notable is the Sub IDC's they are the only "Doc" on a=20 sub.
There=20 are many diffrent areas of the Navy that Corpsman (similar to a Medic, = but not)=20 serve, including the Marine Corps (where I served) and their is a = diffrent=20 flavor of IDC for each area that you are in.  Everything from Subs, = to=20 Special Forces (Seals, and Force Recon) To small ships. =20
and=20 simillarly they are not allowed to do as near as much in the US, as they = are at=20 Sea. 
To=20 Bad.
 
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf = Of=20 LNMolino@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 = 23:46
To:=20 wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: = W-EMED=20 Nasopharyngeal Airways

IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician. =  They have a=20 slew of
training but can't operate unless deployed but then again = they "see=20 patients"
in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians = Assistant.=20  They can
write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active = duty=20 people and only
when filled in a military pharmacy and other things = that are=20 WELL beyond any
civilian scope of practice.  When deployed on = missions=20 out of the US they are
often the "doc" for the mission and act = accordingly.=20  The USAF only has about
3350 active IDMTs at any one time.=20

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI =
LNMolino@aol.com=20

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The = opinions=20 stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form =
reflect the=20 opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated =
with unless=20 otherwise stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0-- _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1MJ41SAB600QJ1C@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from Caverbru@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.e1.122f8a6a (4405) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:43:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:43:46 -0500 (EST) From: Caverbru@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10502 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Pennsylvania they are part of the EMT certification and we use them on our street ambulances, not to hard to put in. As someone said they are good for seizure PT and jaw trauma. Haven't used them in the SAR environment yet. Bru Randall --part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Pennsylvania they are part of the EMT certification and we use them on our
street ambulances, not to hard to put in.  As someone said they are good for
seizure PT and jaw trauma.  Haven't used them in the SAR environment yet.
Bru Randall
--part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:17:36 -0500 (EST) Disposition-notification-to: sepaulsen@home.com Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LX7GD9KU00DW9K@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:17:36 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:17:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com (femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com [24.0.95.128]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:16:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from c1398152a ([24.17.16.8]) by femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with SMTP id <20010325141650.FKME21537.femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com@c1398152a> for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 06:16:50 -0800 Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 08:13:49 -0600 From: "S. Paulsen" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <01C0B44D.FEB61080@63-146-20-181.citynet.net> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk It is true that the cribiform plate is at the back of the nasopharynx I apologize for my misrepresentation of the anatomy, the dilation technique is something I was taught years ago preceding nasal intubations and I don't know of the sources journal or otherwise. It is important to state that this is in combination with neosynephrine for its pure alpha effects and with copious lubrication, not as a general practice and not really repeated insertions. For instance if you started out with a mid size npa and went to the next size up to possibly allow insertion of a size larger et tube nasally. Obviously in the long run it makes for a better course for the patient if we can wean them from the vent with a larger ET tube in place. S. Paulsen NREMT-P Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LFE7M1HU00DW87@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:39 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.43.12868ac2 (18403) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:28 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:27 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <43.12868ac2.27eee033@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician. They have a slew of training but can't operate unless deployed but then again they "see patients" in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians Assistant. They can write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active duty people and only when filled in a military pharmacy and other things that are WELL beyond any civilian scope of practice. When deployed on missions out of the US they are often the "doc" for the mission and act accordingly. The USAF only has about 3350 active IDMTs at any one time. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician.  They have a slew of
training but can't operate unless deployed but then again they "see patients"
in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians Assistant.  They can
write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active duty people and only
when filled in a military pharmacy and other things that are WELL beyond any
civilian scope of practice.  When deployed on missions out of the US they are
often the "doc" for the mission and act accordingly.  The USAF only has about
3350 active IDMTs at any one time.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LFE9XC0Q00P33J@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:42 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m04.mx.aol.com (imo-m04.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.7]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.7c.1375bcc0 (18403) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:15 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngaeal airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <7c.1375bcc0.27eee027@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was under the impression that the only real contraindication of and potential danger for use of an NPA was in cases of skull fracture where it was possible (although unlikely) to actually "intubate" the cranium. I will be looking the "books" tomorrow. BTW, we carry a slew of them in our airway pack in the jump kit as well as plenty of lube. I've Never done one on a real person but understand when I work nothing bad happens to a base with up to 29,500 people on it, go figure? however, If I take a day off they notify the Base Commander of my absence. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was under the impression that the only real contraindication of and
potential danger for use of an NPA was in cases of skull fracture where it
was possible (although unlikely) to actually "intubate" the cranium.  I will
be looking the "books" tomorrow.

BTW, we carry a slew of them in our airway pack in the jump kit as well as
plenty of lube. I've Never done one on a real person but understand when I
work nothing bad happens to a base with up to 29,500 people on it, go figure?
however, If I take a day off they notify the Base Commander of my absence.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LFEDNLUO00ED2L@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.59.8a416e3 (18403) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:27 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:26 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <59.8a416e3.27eee032@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To the guy with 170 hours who thinks he's the equivalent of a First Responder in the States, 170 hours is WAY more then a First Responder in most states. NSC EMT-B is only 110 + CPR add in HAZMAT and ICS in NJ you get 150 pr so and POOF you're an EMT-Basic. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To the guy with 170 hours who thinks he's the equivalent of a First Responder
in the States,

170 hours is WAY more then a First Responder in most states.  NSC EMT-B is
only 110 + CPR add in HAZMAT and ICS in NJ you get 150 pr so and POOF you're
an EMT-Basic.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KXUJF8R200ORPE@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:25 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2OLCNm10263 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:12:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2OLCNZ10258 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:12:23 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:18:45 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:28:50 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC379@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk IDaho & MOntana SAR? -----Original Message----- From: Morgan Young [mailto:theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com] Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 2:54 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways I know what SSG & USAF means, but what does IDMT mean? Independent Duty Medical Technician? -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of Trevor Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 23:53 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways It all depends on what material they are made of. Like inserting a nasal-gastric tube often you will put it in some ice to make it more rigid for insertion. I am not sure which material s remain pliable in the cold and which dont. Trevor Correia, SSG, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instructor --- Jonathan Silver wrote: > Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? > > Thanks, > -Jonathan > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KUO509B800QQT5@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:58 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp016.mail.yahoo.com (smtp016.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.113]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo061.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.193) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 19:53:40 +0000 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:53:38 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <20010324055230.17841.qmail@web6304.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000501c0b49c$1e465ec0$c16bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: I know what SSG & USAF means, but what does IDMT mean? Independent Duty Medical Technician? -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of Trevor Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 23:53 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways It all depends on what material they are made of. Like inserting a nasal-gastric tube often you will put it in some ice to make it more rigid for insertion. I am not sure which material s remain pliable in the cold and which dont. Trevor Correia, SSG, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instructor --- Jonathan Silver wrote: > Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? > > Thanks, > -Jonathan > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:14:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KR6GH2ES00F0XT@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:14:12 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron ("port 1076"@[136.142.22.84]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KR59UVY400QWZR@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu> for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:09 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "S. Paulsen" , wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3ABC9D65.20473.181E0E@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk References: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> On 24 Mar 2001, at 7:07, S. Paulsen wrote: > The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways > was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, > there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, > and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying > where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous > area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an > EMS legend, or maybe not. > Kathryn Park, WEMT There is a single x-ray of this that has been passed around for decades. As far as I know, this is the only time it's ever happened! Well, maybe more than once, but it was an NG tube, not a nasal airway. And I think the danger is overrated, especially if you aim the NG tube along the bottom of the nose, instead of aiming upwards (which tends to rip off the turbinates and cause bleeding). Yes, it looks as though you should aim upwards from the outside, but take a look through the nose with an otoscope or a mini-mag. (I recommend doing this before putting in an NG tube or performing nasotracheal intubation, anyway). You'll see a nice clear passage along the bottom and all sorts of bumpy pink things that like to bleed along the top. Pick the side with the bigger passage. Putting some lidocaine/neosynephrine spray in beforehand helps, and for NT intubation, sticking your little finger deep in the nose (gloved of course) for a minute, ideally coated with lidocaine jelly, will squeeze some of the swelling out of the mucosa and make intubation easier. Nonetheless, at our trauma center, we put NG tubes in orally in those with facial fractures (almost always endotracheally intubated first). Nasal airways aren't long enough to really pith someone, and can make airway management in a trauma patient a lot easier. I say go for it. --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- X-cs: R From: Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP X-RS-ID: X-RS-Flags: 0,0,1,1,0,0,0 X-RS-Header: References: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> X-RS-Header: In-reply-to: X-RS-Sigset: 2 To: "S. Paulsen" ,wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Reply-to: kconover+@pitt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:11:06 -0500 On 24 Mar 2001, at 7:07, S. Paulsen wrote: > The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways > was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, > there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, > and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying > where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous > area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an > EMS legend, or maybe not. > Kathryn Park, WEMT There is a single x-ray of this that has been passed around for decades. As far as I know, this is the only time it's ever happened! Well, maybe more than once, but it was an NG tube, not a nasal airway. And I think the danger is overrated, especially if you aim the NG tube along the bottom of the nose, instead of aiming upwards (which tends to rip off the turbinates and cause bleeding). Yes, it looks as though you should aim upwards from the outside, but take a look through the nose with an otoscope or a mini-mag. (I recommend doing this before putting in an NG tube or performing nasotracheal intubation, anyway). You'll see a nice clear passage along the bottom and all sorts of bumpy pink things that like to bleed along the top. Pick the side with the bigger passage. Putting some lidocaine/neosynephrine spray in beforehand helps, and for NT intubation, sticking your little finger deep in the nose (gloved of course) for a minute, ideally coated with lidocaine jelly, will squeeze some of the swelling out of the mucosa and make intubation easier. Nonetheless, at our trauma center, we put NG tubes in orally in those with facial fractures (almost always endotracheally intubated first). Nasal airways aren't long enough to really pith someone, and can make airway management in a trauma patient a lot easier. I say go for it. -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KLWJTXBO00DW3J@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:27 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.citynet.net (mail2.citynet.net [206.101.104.77]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12966 invoked from network); Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:05 -0500 Received: from main.citynet.net (root@206.101.104.67) by mail2.citynet.net with SMTP; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:05 -0500 Received: from 63-146-20-181.citynet.net (63-146-20-181.citynet.net [63.146.20.181]) by main.citynet.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA09997 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:03 -0500 Received: by 63-146-20-181.citynet.net with Microsoft Mail id <01C0B44D.FEB61080@63-146-20-181.citynet.net>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:34:24 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:14:39 -0500 From: "Stephen R. Mosberg" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <01C0B44D.FEB61080@63-146-20-181.citynet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu id KAA26529 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Generally, suctioning out the intracranial contents is not good form... The cribiform plate is located at the TOP of the nasal cavity, NOT at the back of the throat. It is right behind/between the orbits. At the back of the throat is the upper cervical spine [C-1, C-2] and penetrating that [not easy to do] will have the same result as pithing a frog in bio lab [parenthetically, also not good form...]. Hence, correctly inserting an NP airway limits the chance of intracranial assisted ventilations [air heads]. The incident to which Kathryn refers involved a naso-gastric tube: a longer, more pliable device with a mind of its own and a tendency to go where it's not supposed to be. In fact, an NP airway may guide an NG tube down the esophagus and away from the cribiform plate. But I wouldn't consider this a field maneuver. A common mistake is to insert things UP the nose [toward the top of the head] which is incorrect-even in a nose as big as mine. Such insertions may eventually end up in the right place due to the anatomy, but not w/o significant discomfort and damage. The proper method is INTO the nose, toward the back of the head, parallel to the roof of the mouth. Normally, absent polyps and deviated septums [is that septa?], this part of the nasal passage is larger, allowing whatever device-be it tube, packing, spaghetti, or finger-to pass more easily. [Don't try this at home, boys + girls...] The NP tube is reportedly better tolerated by semiconscious patients who may not tolerate an OP airway [very useful for that snoring bed partner!]. If too long, it will stimulate the larynx causing laryngospasm or vomiting. It makes a good temporizing method for airway support. It is NOT definitive airway management. All my reference texts are at work but it seems the cross-sectional area of the airway provided by an NP is considerably less than an OP airway making bag-valve-mask assisted respirations more difficult although certainly not impossible. The NP airway is preferred in patients w/ trismus [spasm of jaw muscles] or neck/face injuries that preclude an OP. Given space limitations and a limited role for NP airways, i.e., that sub group of patients between awake + able to control their airway and those usually unresponsive patients who cannot support the muscles of their upper airway, I don't carry Nasal trumpets. It's not that they're NOT useful, but their limited role hasn't earned them a place in my airway kit. I've never heard of using an NP as a "nasal dilator" [which means nothing, as there are lots of things I've not heard of...], but empirically, it would seem that the trauma of successive insertions would cause more swelling than dilatation. Are there any references for this technique? Bleeding is a not insignificant consideration, especially if clots are aspirated. I might add it's usually somewhat difficult to determine which patients are prone to nosebleeds. Stephen Mosberg, M.D., DABFP NSS #20444 ---------- From: S. Paulsen[SMTP:sepaulsen@home.com] Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 8:08 AM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways <>The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an EMS legend, or maybe not. Kathryn Park, WEMT Whether the NPA would be affected by temperature would depend on what they were made of, I believe some are made of silicone based stuff. And as far as the use of head injuries, at the back of the throat is the cribiform plate, in basilar skull fractures this is often fractured also and if the tissue is disrupted the NPA can protrude into the cranial vault. I have used NPA often and like them because they are rapid and otherwise safe to put in. They can be useful prior to nasal intubation when used with Neosynephrine if you start out with a smaller size, lubricated with Lidocaine jelly and slowly insert that size and after a few minutes continue to work your way up to a larger size. It dilates the nasal mucosa and makes for a less bloody intubation and can make it more comfortable for the patient. I think the main reason for their being used so little is experience in their use and that there are so many other procedures taught in EMT classes that receive more concentration. Also I think we tend to go full bore in treatment, sometimes, late in the patients course rather than being more proactive and anticipatory at least in basic airway stuff. And a lot of people don't like putting NPA's in. There only drawbacks are initial discomfort and epistaxis if inserted to roughly or in the patients prone to nosebleeds. S .Paulsen NREMT-P Iowa Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:58:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KI9ZB3N400QIM2@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:58:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:57:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:57:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2ODiUg05323 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2ODiTZ05319 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:50:52 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:00:57 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC371@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk Well that depends on the type of material they are made of but you can put them in a bag and warm them up fast in your arm pit or another team members arm pit, I would not recommend using the PT for this though. Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Silver [mailto:JSilverAMC@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 6:02 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? Thanks, -Jonathan Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:02:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KIE2YTM800F0XT@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:02:16 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:00:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (femail3.rdc1.on.home.com [24.2.9.90]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from [24.114.201.181] by femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with ESMTP id <20010324140004.ENZZ12540.femail3.rdc1.on.home.com@[24.114.201.181]> for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 06:00:04 -0800 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 06:00:05 -0800 From: "Steven D. Pirie" Subject: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: sdpirie@mail.slnt1.on.wave.home.com To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Precedence: bulk Kathryn and others, >The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways was >that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, there was a >case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, and the airway >got >inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying where it should have been, >upon xray they found it was in a dangerous area inside his skull, because of >the fracture. This may have been an EMS legend, or maybe not. I was told this in my schooling also, and as a matter of habit never put in an NPA in a person I thought had a Basal Skull Fracture. In the last edition of the Battlefield Advanced Trauma Life Support however, it states: "A suspected fractured base of the skull is not a contraindication for the use of this [NPA] airway if an oropharyngeal airway cannot be inserted." I have also seen casualties in ER that we have put a NPA into and then found out that they had a fracture at the base of the skull, it resulted in no problems with respect to brain injury or outcome. It makes me rethink the old, "no NPA if you think the skull is fractured" teaching. Cheers, Steven ---------------------------------------------------------- Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE Acting Head of Specialist Clinic and Support Canadian Forces Support Unit (Ottawa) Health Care Centre 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit ---------------------------------------------------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:12:48 -0500 (EST) Disposition-notification-to: sepaulsen@home.com Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KGNR3SXA00QIM2@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:12:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:10:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail17.sdc1.sfba.home.com (femail17.sdc1.sfba.home.com [24.0.95.144]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:10:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from c1398152a ([24.17.16.8]) by femail17.sdc1.sfba.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with SMTP id <20010324131046.EAZL9995.femail17.sdc1.sfba.home.com@c1398152a> for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 05:10:46 -0800 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 07:07:46 -0600 From: "S. Paulsen" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01C0B431.20EBDEE0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C0B431.20EBDEE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an EMS legend, or maybe not. Kathryn Park, WEMT Whether the NPA would be affected by temperature would depend on what they were made of, I believe some are made of silicone based stuff. And as far as the use of head injuries, at the back of the throat is the cribiform plate, in basilar skull fractures this is often fractured also and if the tissue is disrupted the NPA can protrude into the cranial vault. I have used NPA often and like them because they are rapid and otherwise safe to put in. They can be useful prior to nasal intubation when used with Neosynephrine if you start out with a smaller size, lubricated with Lidocaine jelly and slowly insert that size and after a few minutes continue to work your way up to a larger size. It dilates the nasal mucosa and makes for a less bloody intubation and can make it more comfortable for the patient. I think the main reason for their being used so little is experience in their use and that there are so many other procedures taught in EMT classes that receive more concentration. Also I think we tend to go full bore in treatment, sometimes, late in the patients course rather than being more proactive and anticipatory at least in basic airway stuff. And a lot of people don't like putting NPA's in. There only drawbacks are initial discomfort and epistaxis if inserted to roughly or in the patients prone to nosebleeds. S .Paulsen NREMT-P Iowa ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C0B431.20EBDEE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The only drawback they mentioned = in EMT class=20 regarding nasal airways was
that they weren't recommended for head = injuries.=20   Apparently, there was a
case where one was used on a = person with=20 a skull fracture, and the airway got
inserted in the wrong = area...instead of=20 staying where it should have been,
upon xray they found it was in a=20 dangerous area inside his skull, because of
the fracture.  This = may=20 have been an EMS legend,  or maybe not.    Kathryn =
Park,=20 WEMT  
 
 
Whether the NPA would be affected by temperature would depend = on what=20 they were made of, I believe some are made of silicone based stuff. = And as far=20 as the use of head injuries, at the back of the throat is the = cribiform plate,=20 in basilar skull fractures this is often fractured also and if the = tissue is=20 disrupted the NPA can protrude into the cranial vault. I have used NPA = often=20 and like them because they are rapid and otherwise safe to put in. = They can be=20 useful prior to nasal intubation when used with Neosynephrine if you = start out=20 with a smaller size, lubricated with Lidocaine jelly and slowly insert = that=20 size and after a few minutes continue to work your way up to a larger = size. It=20 dilates the nasal mucosa and makes for a less bloody intubation and = can make=20 it more comfortable for the patient. I think the main reason for=20  their being used so little = is=20 experience in their use and that there are so many other procedures = taught in=20 EMT classes that receive more concentration. Also I think we tend to = go full=20 bore in treatment, sometimes, late in the patients course rather than = being=20 more proactive and anticipatory at least in basic airway stuff. And a = lot of=20 people don't like putting NPA's in. There only drawbacks are initial=20 discomfort and epistaxis if inserted to roughly or in the patients = prone to=20 nosebleeds.
 
S .Paulsen NREMT-P
Iowa 
------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C0B431.20EBDEE0-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 00:52:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1K1AAAYDY00QIK8@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 00:52:50 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 00:52:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from web6304.mail.yahoo.com (web6304.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.22.141]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 00:52:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from [165.76.24.136] by web6304.mail.yahoo.com; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 21:52:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 21:52:30 -0800 (PST) From: Trevor Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010324055230.17841.qmail@web6304.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk It all depends on what material they are made of. Like inserting a nasal-gastric tube often you will put it in some ice to make it more rigid for insertion. I am not sure which material s remain pliable in the cold and which dont. Trevor Correia, SSG, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instructor --- Jonathan Silver wrote: > Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? > > Thanks, > -Jonathan > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:44:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JYWTBHBO00QNBB@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:44:42 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:43:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r15.mx.aol.com (imo-r15.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.69]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:43:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from Kathrynpark@cs.com by imo-r15.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.6a.c682513 (9614) for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:43:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 23:43:11 -0500 (EST) From: Kathrynpark@cs.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: CompuServe 2000 6.0 for Windows US sub 352 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_6a.c682513.27ed7fdf_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_6a.c682513.27ed7fdf_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an EMS legend, or maybe not. Kathryn Park, WEMT --part1_6a.c682513.27ed7fdf_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways was
that they weren't recommended for head injuries.   Apparently, there was a
case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, and the airway got
inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying where it should have been,
upon xray they found it was in a dangerous area inside his skull, because of
the fracture.  This may have been an EMS legend,  or maybe not.    Kathryn
Park, WEMT --part1_6a.c682513.27ed7fdf_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:01:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JMXVPFAQ00E0YG@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:01:58 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:01:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (oe31.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.88]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:01:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:01:08 -0800 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 18:01:33 -0500 From: Jonathan Silver Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: Organization: Appalachian Mountain Club MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: [63.17.150.192] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Mar 2001 23:01:08.0809 (UTC) FILETIME=[25BC4390:01C0B3ED] References: <3ABA7089.2052.16B3990@localhost> Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? Thanks, -Jonathan Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:57:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JKP3E7OK00F0XT@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:57:37 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:57:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (femail3.rdc1.on.home.com [24.2.9.90]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 16:57:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from [24.114.201.181] by femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with ESMTP id <20010323215636.DPAK4786.femail3.rdc1.on.home.com@[24.114.201.181]> for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:56:36 -0800 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:56:37 -0800 From: "Steven D. Pirie" Subject: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <001301c0b3ac$963cfce0$c9e1b9c7@name> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: sdpirie@mail.slnt1.on.wave.home.com To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Precedence: bulk References: <3ABA7089.2052.16B3990@localhost> >As a part of this program, we cover the use of both nasopharyngeal and >oropharyngeal airways. In practice, however, I find that the only ones used >are OPAs. I have not even seen an NPA except in pictures. Is there a >reason for this? Is there a danger in their use that I'm not aware of? I carry them in my field bag as a "back up" method for airway management. They are great if the caualty has an oral injury, fractured mandible or is in massetter spasm. Furthermore, if the casualty is more responsive then they are better tolerated then an OPA. Skill wise, you can use an OPA you can use a NPA. Why not carry them... cannot think of any good reason. I carry three of them (26, 30, 34 Fr) and the weight /space is a non issue. The packet of lubercant as other uses as well as for the nasal airway insertion, so that is good also. Cheers, Steven ---------------------------------------------------------- Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE Acting Head of Specialist Clinic and Support Canadian Forces Support Unit (Ottawa) Health Care Centre 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit ---------------------------------------------------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:02:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JGOUPIVG00E0YG@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:02:53 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:02:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:02:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2NJo0H12092 for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:50:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2NJnwZ12078 for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:49:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:56:20 -0500 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:06:17 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC36E@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C0B3D4.B8975CE0" Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C0B3D4.B8975CE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Donovan, You caught me away from my EMT manual but a I have used NPA on PT who was actively seizing and needed to be bagged. Additionally if you have a PT with a massive jaw trauma a NPA is away us EMT-B's can get a patient airway since we can not tube. It is another technique to have in your bag of tricks. Here is the text from the instructor notes for the EMT B course (avail on line at the US Dept of Transportation web site and free to down load): B. Nasopharyngeal (nasal) airways: 1. Nasopharyngeal airways are less likely to stimulate vomiting and may be used on patients who are responsive but need assistance keeping the tongue from obstructing the airway. Even though the tube is lubricated, this is a painful stimulus. 2. Select the proper size: Measure from the tip of the nose to the tip of the patient's ear. Also consider diameter of airway in the nostril. 3. Lubricate the airway with a water soluble lubricant. 4. Insert it posteriorly. Bevel should be toward the base of the nostril or toward the septum. 5. If the airway cannot be inserted into one nostril, try the other nostril. Chuck -----Original Message----- From: MYScher@aol.com [mailto:MYScher@aol.com] Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 2:30 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In combat, oral airways are all we'd carried (this was in the 80's). I suspect it's because they provide a little more protection (controlling the tongue, and doubling as a bite-block with or without later intubation), and we always needed to save weight and space. If it got dirty or otherwise yucked-up, it was easier to clean and reinsert. Similar considerations for extended SAR. When I've used NPAs on civilian patients, they seem to really improve the airflow. We do carry them on our trucks. One of my paramedic instructors self-inserted one on a dare, and said it produced a radical difference on the side with the airway (*and* he didn't need to blow his nose for about a week). Eric (the instructor) is available for parties and functions... :-). mordechai y. scher combat medic 09, Israel Defense Forces paramedic intern EMT, Spencer Rescue ------_=_NextPart_001_01C0B3D4.B8975CE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"

Donovan,

You caught me away from my EMT manual but a I have used NPA on PT who was actively seizing and needed to be bagged. Additionally if you have a PT with a massive jaw trauma a NPA is away us EMT-B's can get a patient airway since we can not tube.  It is another technique to have in your bag of tricks.

Here is the text from the instructor notes for the EMT B course (avail on line at the US Dept of Transportation web site and free to down load):

B. Nasopharyngeal (nasal) airways:

1. Nasopharyngeal airways are less likely to stimulate vomiting and may be used on patients who are responsive but need assistance keeping the tongue from obstructing the airway. Even though the tube is lubricated, this is a painful stimulus.

2. Select the proper size: Measure from the tip of the nose to the tip of the patient's ear. Also consider diameter of airway in the nostril.

3. Lubricate the airway with a water soluble lubricant.

4. Insert it posteriorly. Bevel should be toward the base of the nostril or toward the septum.

5. If the airway cannot be inserted into one nostril, try the other nostril.

Chuck

-----Original Message-----
From: MYScher@aol.com [mailto:MYScher@aol.com]
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 2:30 PM
To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways

In combat, oral airways are all we'd carried (this was in the 80's).  I
suspect it's because they provide a little more protection (controlling the
tongue, and doubling as a bite-block with or without later intubation), and
we always needed to save weight and space.  If it got dirty or otherwise
yucked-up, it was easier to clean and reinsert.  Similar considerations for
extended SAR.

When I've used NPAs on civilian patients, they seem to really improve the
airflow.  We do carry them on our trucks.  One of my paramedic instructors
self-inserted one on a dare, and said it produced a radical difference on the
side with the airway (*and* he didn't need to blow his nose for about a
week).  Eric (the instructor) is available for parties and functions... :-).

mordechai y. scher
combat medic 09, Israel Defense Forces
paramedic intern
EMT, Spencer Rescue ------_=_NextPart_001_01C0B3D4.B8975CE0-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:04:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JGQHKVJ200QTYC@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:04:12 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:04:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:04:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from Omikid@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.12.a897466 (3972) for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:03:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 15:03:05 -0500 (EST) From: Omikid@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <12.a897466.27ed05f9@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 127 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk We use NPA's pretty frequently in our progressive care unit in the hospital. They do improve air flow, and make for less nasal trauma (as well as ease for care giver)when the patient needs NT suctioning. They are very easy to put in as well. You have to be careful about putting in one that is too SMALL for a patient however. I have heard of one time a NPA being too small, becoming occluded, and then being sucked into the nare by a patient and getting lodged in her throat. We do have one pulmonologist who does not like them and will not have them used on any of his patients. Not sure why, next time I have a chance, I will ask him. Take care, Naomi "I distinctly remember forgetting that" Clara Barton when asked about an incident where a friend of hers had said something that hurt her deeply. Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:51:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JGB3E3QW00DW3J@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:51:48 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:51:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx02.iprimus.com.au (mx02.iprimus.com.au [203.134.65.91]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:51:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from gosta ([203.134.32.130]) by mx02.iprimus.com.au with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.537.53); Sat, 24 Mar 2001 06:55:04 +1100 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 06:46:11 +1100 From: Gosta Subject: W-EMED Nasopharyngaeal airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001001c0b3d1$ea775600$822086cb@gosta> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0B42E.1D3FF540" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0B42E.1D3FF540 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I'm an intensive care paramedic in Sydney/Australia. I use = nasopharyngaeal airways quite often. Our basic EMT's use them as well. = There is no real danger in using them other than nasal trauma, provided = you use the correct size. You will need a little practice in inserting = them. They are good for patients who have trismus and an oral airway can = not be used. Also, sometimes oropharyngaeal airways can actually cause = occlusion if they don't fit properly. They should both be in your kit = and you would probably find use for both. About the patient who gags = when you try to insert an oral airway. You can probably manage that = patients' airway well without inserting anything. Hope that helps some. G=F6sta Liljeqvist ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0B42E.1D3FF540 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,
I'm an intensive care = paramedic in=20 Sydney/Australia. I use nasopharyngaeal airways quite often. Our basic = EMT's use=20 them as well. There is no real danger in using them other than nasal = trauma,=20 provided you use the correct size. You will need a little practice in = inserting=20 them. They are good for patients who have trismus and an oral airway can = not be=20 used. Also, sometimes oropharyngaeal airways can actually cause = occlusion if=20 they don't fit properly. They should both be in your kit and you would = probably=20 find use for both. About the patient who gags when you try to insert an = oral=20 airway. You can probably manage that patients' airway well without = inserting=20 anything.
 
Hope that helps = some.
G=F6sta=20 Liljeqvist
------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0B42E.1D3FF540-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:30:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JFJWXAP400QNBB@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:30:40 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:30:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r16.mx.aol.com (imo-r16.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.70]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:30:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from MYScher@aol.com by imo-r16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.cb.f34ab7b (17230) for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:29:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 14:29:43 -0500 (EST) From: MYScher@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows CA sub 92 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_cb.f34ab7b.27ecfe27_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_cb.f34ab7b.27ecfe27_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In combat, oral airways are all we'd carried (this was in the 80's). I suspect it's because they provide a little more protection (controlling the tongue, and doubling as a bite-block with or without later intubation), and we always needed to save weight and space. If it got dirty or otherwise yucked-up, it was easier to clean and reinsert. Similar considerations for extended SAR. When I've used NPAs on civilian patients, they seem to really improve the airflow. We do carry them on our trucks. One of my paramedic instructors self-inserted one on a dare, and said it produced a radical difference on the side with the airway (*and* he didn't need to blow his nose for about a week). Eric (the instructor) is available for parties and functions... :-). mordechai y. scher combat medic 09, Israel Defense Forces paramedic intern EMT, Spencer Rescue --part1_cb.f34ab7b.27ecfe27_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In combat, oral airways are all we'd carried (this was in the 80's).  I
suspect it's because they provide a little more protection (controlling the
tongue, and doubling as a bite-block with or without later intubation), and
we always needed to save weight and space.  If it got dirty or otherwise
yucked-up, it was easier to clean and reinsert.  Similar considerations for
extended SAR.

When I've used NPAs on civilian patients, they seem to really improve the
airflow.  We do carry them on our trucks.  One of my paramedic instructors
self-inserted one on a dare, and said it produced a radical difference on the
side with the airway (*and* he didn't need to blow his nose for about a
week).  Eric (the instructor) is available for parties and functions... :-).

mordechai y. scher
combat medic 09, Israel Defense Forces
paramedic intern
EMT, Spencer Rescue --part1_cb.f34ab7b.27ecfe27_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:10:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1JCRKKU4S00QCJY@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:10:33 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:10:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com (femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com [24.0.95.107]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 13:10:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from [65.4.130.19] by femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with ESMTP id <20010323181005.GPSD14052.femail11.sdc1.sfba.home.com@[65.4.130.19]> for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:10:05 -0800 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:15:27 -0800 From: Doug Burchard Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <001301c0b3ac$963cfce0$c9e1b9c7@name> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 > on 3/23/01 7:18 AM, Donovan Hoggan wrote: > I am confused about an issue and I hope someone on the list can clear this > up. I am the First-aid Coordinator of a new SAR team in Alberta. My > medical training is limited to a 170-hour AFA II; in the States I think it > would be the equivalent of First Responder. > > As a part of this program, we cover the use of both nasopharyngeal and > oropharyngeal airways. In practice, however, I find that the only ones used > are OPAs. I have not even seen an NPA except in pictures. Is there a > reason for this? Is there a danger in their use that I'm not aware of? > > My confusion comes from what may be an inaccurate understanding. If OPAs > will easily trigger a gag reflex in a semi-conscious patient and NPAs won't, > wouldn't the latter be safer? Is it that they are more difficult to use? > What am I missing here? I don't have any answers for you, but I'm also interested in the same. My OEC (ski patrol), and WEMT training both covered NPAs, however the EMT-B training here in King County WA strictly precludes the use of NPAs. Though several doctors and nurses I work with actually prefer them in most circumstances. I've never used them on a live person, but they never seemed that difficult in training. -- Douglas Burchard, OEC, WEMT-B email: burchard@nwlink.com King County Search and Rescue (KCSARA) phone: 206/227-8161 Training Coordinator fax: 208/293-8639 SPRING Academy 2001, April 7, 8, 28, and 29. Course Signups: http://www.kcsara.org/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:25:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1J6ZY103S00QIK8@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:25:30 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:24:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.memlane.com (mail.memlane.com [199.185.225.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 10:24:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from name ([199.185.225.190]) by mail.memlane.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-55152U3000L300S0V35) with SMTP id com for ; Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:23:56 -0700 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 08:18:25 -0700 From: Donovan Hoggan Subject: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001301c0b3ac$963cfce0$c9e1b9c7@name> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: <3ABA7089.2052.16B3990@localhost> Hello All I am confused about an issue and I hope someone on the list can clear this up. I am the First-aid Coordinator of a new SAR team in Alberta. My medical training is limited to a 170-hour AFA II; in the States I think it would be the equivalent of First Responder. As a part of this program, we cover the use of both nasopharyngeal and oropharyngeal airways. In practice, however, I find that the only ones used are OPAs. I have not even seen an NPA except in pictures. Is there a reason for this? Is there a danger in their use that I'm not aware of? My confusion comes from what may be an inaccurate understanding. If OPAs will easily trigger a gag reflex in a semi-conscious patient and NPAs won't, wouldn't the latter be safer? Is it that they are more difficult to use? What am I missing here? Thank you in advance for your help. Donovan Hoggan, R.S.W. First-Aid Coordinator South Eastern Alberta Search & Rescue (SEASAR) Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:39:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1IG9HJY7400B850@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:39:42 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:37:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:37:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron ("port 2488"@[136.142.22.136]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1IG6K7MIO00QCJY@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu> for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:37:22 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 21:37:13 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: W-EMED list "closed" to non-subscribers Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3ABA7089.2052.16B3990@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk As of now, only those email addresses actually s u b s c r i b e d to the list can post to the list. This will not eliminate spam -- someone can join and post spam (although I will delete them from the list). However, it should cut down on the spam quite a bit. If you find that you need to post from another address than that under which you're subscribed, please s u b s c r i b e that other address, too. Thank you. --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP listowner Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 5 Mar 2001 03:12:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0TMMB7M9G00J8TX@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 5 Mar 2001 03:12:02 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 05 Mar 2001 03:11:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from g04.syd.iprimus.net.au (g04.syd.iprimus.net.au [203.134.65.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 05 Mar 2001 03:11:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 3165 invoked from network); Mon, 05 Mar 2001 08:12:15 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gosta) (203.134.32.252) by g04.syd.iprimus.net.au with SMTP; Mon, 05 Mar 2001 08:12:15 +0000 Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 19:06:31 +1100 From: Gosta Subject: Re: W-EMED inhaled analgaesia Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <002a01c0a54b$30e7c600$fc2086cb@gosta> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0027_01C0A5A7.6365A0A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01C0A5A7.6365A0A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable David, Yes it is a good SAR tool. I personally use it and it is effective. = Works well on children too. It smells strongly (some say) like = juicyfruit. I think like ether. I am concerned though about using it in = confined spaces. (concern regarding staff repeat exposure) Did you send this message to me or to the list? It looks here as though = it came from you and not the list. I'm happy to provide details of manufacturer etc. if you're interested.=20 G=F6sta Liljeqvist ----- Original Message -----=20 From: The Tate's=20 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 Sent: Monday, March 05, 2001 5:56 PM Subject: RE: W-EMED inhaled analgaesia The green little pipe you saw on survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" = through which methoxyflurane is administered. Up to 6 ml (dose specified = in volume) can be given in one day. In Australia, this drug has replaced = nitrous oxide. I have also worked in Sweden where Methoxyflurane in = banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other things. I believe it is = also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform me.=20 =20 Figures.... Can anyone confirm it is banned here? I saw it twice now = the first time on Eco-Challenge and then again on Survivor. In both = cases it seems to be the perfect SAR tool, the subject went from = incredible pain to being ambulatory. The device was obviously portable, = compact and light. =20 Thanks =20 David Tate =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01C0A5A7.6365A0A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
David,
Yes it is a good SAR = tool. I=20 personally use it and it is effective. Works well on children too. It = smells=20 strongly (some say) like juicyfruit. I think like ether. I am concerned = though=20 about using it in confined spaces. (concern regarding staff repeat=20 exposure)
Did you send this message = to me or to=20 the list? It looks here as though it came from you and not the=20 list.
I'm happy to provide = details of=20 manufacturer etc. if you're interested.
G=F6sta = Liljeqvist
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 The=20 Tate's
To: wilderness-emergency-= medicine@list.pitt.edu=20
Sent: Monday, March 05, 2001 = 5:56=20 PM
Subject: RE: W-EMED inhaled=20 analgaesia

The green little = pipe you saw=20 on survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" through which methoxyflurane is=20 administered. Up to 6 ml (dose specified in volume) can be given in = one day.=20 In Australia, this drug has replaced nitrous oxide. I have also worked = in=20 Sweden where Methoxyflurane in banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among = other=20 things. I believe it is also banned in the US. Maybe someone can = inform=20 me. 
 
Figures.... Can anyone=20 confirm it is banned here? I saw it twice now the first time on = Eco-Challenge=20 and then again on Survivor. In both cases it seems to be the perfect = SAR tool,=20 the subject went from incredible pain to being = ambulatory. The device was obviously portable, = compact and=20 light.
 
Thanks
 
David = Tate
 
= ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01C0A5A7.6365A0A0-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 5 Mar 2001 01:56:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0TK06Y3V200BUQB@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 5 Mar 2001 01:56:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 05 Mar 2001 01:56:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from StarGazer.TenForward.com (postfix@[206.213.105.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 05 Mar 2001 01:56:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from tenforward.com (unknown [206.213.105.2]) by StarGazer.TenForward.com (Postfix Relay Hub) with ESMTP id 5C7A6CC45 for ; Sun, 04 Mar 2001 22:56:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from david [209.168.55.11] by tenforward.com (SMTPD32-6.06) id A8847516002E; Sun, 04 Mar 2001 22:56:04 -0800 Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2001 22:56:02 -0800 From: "The Tate's" Subject: RE: W-EMED inhaled analgaesia In-reply-to: <001b01c0a435$9b209680$c70686cb@gosta> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C0A4FE.4949DDC0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C0A4FE.4949DDC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The green little pipe you saw on survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" through which methoxyflurane is administered. Up to 6 ml (dose specified in volume) can be given in one day. In Australia, this drug has replaced nitrous oxide. I have also worked in Sweden where Methoxyflurane in banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other things. I believe it is also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform me. Figures.... Can anyone confirm it is banned here? I saw it twice now the first time on Eco-Challenge and then again on Survivor. In both cases it seems to be the perfect SAR tool, the subject went from incredible pain to being ambulatory. The device was obviously portable, compact and light. Thanks David Tate ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C0A4FE.4949DDC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The green little = pipe you saw=20 on survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" through which methoxyflurane is=20 administered. Up to 6 ml (dose specified in volume) can be given in one = day. In=20 Australia, this drug has replaced nitrous oxide. I have also worked in = Sweden=20 where Methoxyflurane in banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other = things. I=20 believe it is also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform me. 
 
Figures.... Can anyone=20 confirm it is banned here? I saw it twice now the first time on = Eco-Challenge=20 and then again on Survivor. In both cases it seems to be the perfect SAR = tool,=20 the subject went from incredible pain to being = ambulatory. The device was obviously portable, compact = and=20 light.
 
Thanks
 
David Tate
 
------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01C0A4FE.4949DDC0-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 18:04:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0RP7N0FQQ00BO26@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 18:04:55 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 18:04:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from g04.syd.iprimus.net.au (g04.syd.iprimus.net.au [203.134.65.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 18:04:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 17902 invoked from network); Sat, 03 Mar 2001 23:04:57 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gosta) (203.134.6.199) by g04.syd.iprimus.net.au with SMTP; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 23:04:57 +0000 Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2001 09:59:29 +1100 From: Gosta Subject: W-EMED inhaled analgaesia Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001b01c0a435$9b209680$c70686cb@gosta> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I am a Sydney Paramedic. The green little pipe you saw on survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" = through which methoxyflurane is administered. Up to 6 ml (dose specified = in volume) can be given in one day. In Australia, this drug has replaced = nitrous oxide. I have also worked in Sweden where Methoxyflurane in = banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other things. I believe it is = also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform me. It is being used here in Oz because it does not cause expansion problems = like nitrous oxide, is easy to carry (no big cylinders), and is cheap. = Some of us are worried about using it in confined spaces. Personally, I = only use it outside and never in the back of the ambulance. The health = department states that it has carried out a safety survey and claims it = is safe for us to use. G=F6sta Liljeqvist B. Health Sc. (Pre-hospital Care) Advanced Dip. Paramedical Sc. Intensive Care Paramedic gosta@iprimus.com.au=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi, I am a Sydney=20 Paramedic.
The green little pipe you = saw on=20 survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" through which methoxyflurane is = administered.=20 Up to 6 ml (dose specified in volume) can be given in one day. In = Australia,=20 this drug has replaced nitrous oxide. I have also worked in Sweden where = Methoxyflurane in banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other things. = I=20 believe it is also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform = me.
It is being used here in = Oz because=20 it does not cause expansion problems like nitrous oxide, is easy to = carry (no=20 big cylinders), and is cheap. Some of us are worried about using it in = confined=20 spaces. Personally, I only use it outside and never in the back of the=20 ambulance. The health department states that it has carried out a safety = survey=20 and claims it is safe for us to use.
 
G=F6sta = Liljeqvist
B. Health Sc. = (Pre-hospital Care)=20 Advanced Dip. Paramedical Sc.
Intensive Care = Paramedic
gosta@iprimus.com.au =
 
------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 18:04:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0RP7N0FQQ00BO26@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 18:04:55 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 18:04:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from g04.syd.iprimus.net.au (g04.syd.iprimus.net.au [203.134.65.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 18:04:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 17902 invoked from network); Sat, 03 Mar 2001 23:04:57 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gosta) (203.134.6.199) by g04.syd.iprimus.net.au with SMTP; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 23:04:57 +0000 Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2001 09:59:29 +1100 From: Gosta Subject: W-EMED inhaled analgaesia Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001b01c0a435$9b209680$c70686cb@gosta> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I am a Sydney Paramedic. The green little pipe you saw on survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" = through which methoxyflurane is administered. Up to 6 ml (dose specified = in volume) can be given in one day. In Australia, this drug has replaced = nitrous oxide. I have also worked in Sweden where Methoxyflurane in = banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other things. I believe it is = also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform me. It is being used here in Oz because it does not cause expansion problems = like nitrous oxide, is easy to carry (no big cylinders), and is cheap. = Some of us are worried about using it in confined spaces. Personally, I = only use it outside and never in the back of the ambulance. The health = department states that it has carried out a safety survey and claims it = is safe for us to use. G=F6sta Liljeqvist B. Health Sc. (Pre-hospital Care) Advanced Dip. Paramedical Sc. Intensive Care Paramedic gosta@iprimus.com.au=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi, I am a Sydney=20 Paramedic.
The green little pipe you = saw on=20 survivor was a "Penthrox Inhaler" through which methoxyflurane is = administered.=20 Up to 6 ml (dose specified in volume) can be given in one day. In = Australia,=20 this drug has replaced nitrous oxide. I have also worked in Sweden where = Methoxyflurane in banned due to its' nephrotoxicity among other things. = I=20 believe it is also banned in the US. Maybe someone can inform = me.
It is being used here in = Oz because=20 it does not cause expansion problems like nitrous oxide, is easy to = carry (no=20 big cylinders), and is cheap. Some of us are worried about using it in = confined=20 spaces. Personally, I only use it outside and never in the back of the=20 ambulance. The health department states that it has carried out a safety = survey=20 and claims it is safe for us to use.
 
G=F6sta = Liljeqvist
B. Health Sc. = (Pre-hospital Care)=20 Advanced Dip. Paramedical Sc.
Intensive Care = Paramedic
gosta@iprimus.com.au =
 
------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C0A491.CDC7A400-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 12:25:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0RDCFHQ1U00JVYT@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 12:25:11 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 12:25:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from inago.swcp.com (inago.swcp.com [198.59.115.17]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 12:24:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (tanman@localhost) by inago.swcp.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA27077 for ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 10:20:30 -0700 (MST) Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 10:20:30 -0700 (MST) From: TANMAN Subject: W-EMED Inhaled Morphine In-reply-to: <20010303165730.348.qmail@web1102.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: inago.swcp.com: tanman owned process doing -bs Have used Morphine Neds it works great, but you need to double or triple your dose, as a lot gets lost in the vapor. I like to use 20 mg Morhpine in 10 cc of NS and then neb it in over 10-15 minutes. Works great. Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email Albuquerque, New Mexico __________________________________________________________________ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 11:58:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0RCFBF6JO005XK6@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 3 Mar 2001 11:58:29 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 11:57:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from web1102.mail.yahoo.com (web1102.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.23.122]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 11:57:31 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 349 invoked by uid 60001); Sat, 03 Mar 2001 16:57:30 +0000 Received: from [207.252.166.132] by web1102.mail.yahoo.com; Sat, 03 Mar 2001 08:57:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 08:57:30 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Williams Subject: W-EMED Inhaled anesthetics in the field Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010303165730.348.qmail@web1102.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk Greetings! If any of you were watching survivor (and I suspect more than a few of you) this week, a castmember was badly burned on his hands and wrists. The medics gave him a green plastic cylinder and told him to inhale, that it was an anestheic. It seemed to help acutely, and they were able to dress the wounds and get Iv access on him. My question is; What was in that green plastic cylinder. Michael (The castmember) didn't seem to be under the effects of a general anestetic such as N2O, and the device didn't seem to hold a high pressure gas. If you can shoot Narcan down an ET tube, can you inhale some MSO4 and get at the same receptors? Whatever the device was, it certainly has a great deal of relevence in the field! Any insight would be greatly appreciated. Michael B. Williams, D.O. Intern Frankford Hospital, Philadelphia __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:28:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0NEYMZUA800IXBI@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:28:10 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:27:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.47]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:27:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from comp1 ([12.79.67.153]) by mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net (InterMail vM.4.01.03.16 201-229-121-116-20010115) with SMTP id <20010228212704.LOLY26039.mtiwmhc22.worldnet.att.net@comp1> for ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 21:27:04 +0000 Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:20:14 -0500 From: Al Juliano Subject: Re: W-EMED W-EMT jobs? Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001501c0a1cc$3ed1a1a0$99434f0c@comp1> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C0A1A2.548BDD00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: <003e01c0a1c3$a7ee97a0$5c3394d0@oemcomputer> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C0A1A2.548BDD00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This question has been asked previously on a few of these lists. From = what we hear, there isn't a lot available in the WEMT field. A few of = my friends in the past have been able to do some SAR and EMT work as = seasonal rangers for the National Park Service. A listing of ranger = jobs is available on the USA Jobs website. Good Luck! Al Juliano ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Michelle Schonzeit=20 To: W-MED list=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2001 3:18 PM Subject: W-EMED W-EMT jobs? Good Afternoon, I am Nursing student / W-EMT and was wondering if anyone is aware = of job openings for SAR / W-EMT summer employment. I've been involved = with volunteer SAR work in the Northern Adirondacks for 4 years, = however, I'm looking to expand my background a bit to gain greater = experience, as well as earn some money to tackle college bills. = (volunteer work can get VERY expensive, on top of being a full time = student!) So if anyone is aware of W-EMT openings or has other suggestions = I'd really appreciate it! Thanks, Michelle Schonzeit W-EMT schonzeit@westelcom.com=20 Whiteface Mt. Ski Patrol Administrator SAR of the Northern Adirondacks - Training Officer ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C0A1A2.548BDD00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This question has been = asked previously=20 on a few of these lists.  From what we hear, there isn't a lot = available in=20 the WEMT field.  A few of my friends in the past have been able to = do some=20 SAR and EMT work as seasonal rangers for the National Park = Service.  A=20 listing of ranger jobs is available on the USA Jobs website.  Good=20 Luck!
 
Al Juliano
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Michelle Schonzeit
To: W-MED list =
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, = 2001 3:18=20 PM
Subject: W-EMED W-EMT = jobs?

Good Afternoon,
 
    I am Nursing student / W-EMT = and was=20 wondering if anyone is aware of job openings for SAR / W-EMT = summer=20 employment. I've been involved with volunteer SAR work in = the=20 Northern Adirondacks for 4 years, however, I'm looking to expand = my=20 background a bit to gain greater experience, as well as earn = some=20 money to tackle college bills. (volunteer work can get VERY expensive, = on top=20 of being a full time student!)
    So if anyone is aware of=20 W-EMT openings or has other suggestions I'd really = appreciate=20 it!
 
Thanks,
 
Michelle Schonzeit  W-EMT
schonzeit@westelcom.com=20
Whiteface Mt. Ski Patrol = Administrator
SAR of the Northern Adirondacks - Training=20 Officer
------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C0A1A2.548BDD00-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 15:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0NCCXQUXK00IKGH@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 15:13:24 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 15:12:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.westelcom.com (mail.westelcom.com [12.23.26.9]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 15:12:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from oemcomputer [208.148.51.92] by mail.westelcom.com (SMTPD32-6.06) id AADD4EA006E; Wed, 28 Feb 2001 15:09:01 -0500 Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 15:18:20 -0500 From: Michelle Schonzeit Subject: W-EMED W-EMT jobs? Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: W-MED list Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <003e01c0a1c3$a7ee97a0$5c3394d0@oemcomputer> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0039_01C0A199.AF379EA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C0A199.AF379EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Good Afternoon, I am Nursing student / W-EMT and was wondering if anyone is aware of = job openings for SAR / W-EMT summer employment. I've been involved with = volunteer SAR work in the Northern Adirondacks for 4 years, however, I'm = looking to expand my background a bit to gain greater experience, as = well as earn some money to tackle college bills. (volunteer work can get = VERY expensive, on top of being a full time student!) So if anyone is aware of W-EMT openings or has other suggestions I'd = really appreciate it! Thanks, Michelle Schonzeit W-EMT schonzeit@westelcom.com=20 Whiteface Mt. Ski Patrol Administrator SAR of the Northern Adirondacks - Training Officer ------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C0A199.AF379EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Good Afternoon,
 
    I am Nursing student / W-EMT and = was=20 wondering if anyone is aware of job openings for SAR / W-EMT summer = employment. I've been involved with volunteer SAR work in the = Northern=20 Adirondacks for 4 years, however, I'm looking to expand my = background=20 a bit to gain greater experience, as well as earn some money = to tackle=20 college bills. (volunteer work can get VERY expensive, on top of being a = full=20 time student!)
    So if anyone is aware of=20 W-EMT openings or has other suggestions I'd really appreciate=20 it!
 
Thanks,
 
Michelle Schonzeit  W-EMT
schonzeit@westelcom.com =
Whiteface Mt. Ski Patrol Administrator
SAR of the Northern Adirondacks - Training=20 Officer
------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C0A199.AF379EA0-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:24:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0LU9NUJF600ICRA@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:24:34 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:24:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from sm8.texas.rr.com (sm8.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.220]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:24:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from connolly (cs2875-174.austin.rr.com [24.28.75.174]) by sm8.texas.rr.com (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f1RII7K21035; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 12:18:07 -0600 Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 12:24:11 -0600 (CST) From: Micheal Mc Evoy Subject: W-EMED SPAM Report Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: abuse@verizon.net Cc: Wilderness Emergency Medicine List Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk The attached spam was sent to a maillist dealing with Wilderness Emergency Medicine. Couls you please deal with the responsible party. I understand that they may not actually have an account with Verizon. Thank you, Micheal ----- Micheal Mc Evoy voyageur@whitepine.com Swift Water Rescue Tech Wilderness EMT-B Travis County Search & Rescue Austin, Texas --- frances.bean@verizon.net wrote: > TO BE REMOVED FROM FUTURE MAILINGS, SIMPLY REPLY TO > THIS MESSAGE AND PUT "REMOVE" IN THE SUBJECT. > > > 142 MILLION > EMAIL ADDRESSES > FOR ONLY $149 > > > > You want to make some money? > > > I can put you in touch with over 140 million > people at virtually no cost. > > > Can you make one cent from each of theses names? > > > If you can you have a profit of over $1,400,000.00 > > > > That's right, I have over 142 Million Fresh > email > > > addresses that I will sell for only $149. These are > all > > > fresh addresses that include almost every person > > > on the Internet today, with no duplications. They > are > > > all sorted and ready to be mailed. That is the best > > > > deal anywhere today! Imagine selling a product for > > > only $5 and getting only a 1% response. That's > OVER > > > $7,000,000 IN YOUR POCKET !!! > > > Don't believe it? People are making that kind of > > > money right now by doing the same thing, that is > > > why you get so much email from people selling you > > > their product....it works! I will even tell you how > to > > > mail them with easy to follow step-by-step > > > instructions I include with every order. > > > I will send you a copy of every law concerning > > > email. It is easy to obey the law and make a > > > fortune. These 142 Million email addresses are > > > yours to keep, so you can use them over and > > > over. They come on a collection of several CDs. > > > This offer is not for everyone. If you can not > > > see the just how excellent the risk / reward ratio > > > in this offer is then there is nothing I can do > > > for you. To make money you must stop dreaming > > > and TAKE ACTION. > > > THREE PACKAGES - BRONZE (addresses ONLY) > SILVER (mailing software > included) > GOLD ( everything to make the > Internet > your personal bank > account) > > > PACKAGE DESCRIPTIONS BELOW; > **************************************** > > > THE BRONZE MARKETING SETUP (addresses ONLY) > > > 142,000,000 email addresses on CD > > > These name are all in text files > > > ready to mail!!! > > > $149.00 > > > SEVERAL WAYS TO ORDER !!! > > > TO ORDER BY PHONE - CALL 530-343-9681 > > > OTHER PACKAGES AND OTHER METHODS - SEE BELOW > > > **************************************** > > > THE SILVER MARKETING SETUP > > > 142,000,000 email addresses on CD > > > These name are all in text files > > > ready to mail!!! AND > > > Several different email programs > > > and tools to help with your mailings > > > and list management. > > > $ 189.00 > > > SEVERAL WAYS TO ORDER !!! > > > TO ORDER BY PHONE - CALL 530-343-9681 > > > OTHER PACKAGES AND OTHER METHODS - SEE BELOW > > > **************************************** > > > THE GOLD MARKETING SETUP > > > VIRTUALLY EVERYTHING!! > > > 142,000,000 email addresses on CD > > > These name are all in text files > > > ready to mail!!! AND > > > Several different email programs > > > and tools to help with your mailings > > > and list management. > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:20:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0LU43YWU400IPEB@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:20:06 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:19:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from sm10.texas.rr.com (sm10.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.222]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:19:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from connolly (cs2875-174.austin.rr.com [24.28.75.174]) by sm10.texas.rr.com (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f1RIDWq22622 for ; Tue, 27 Feb 2001 12:13:32 -0600 Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 12:19:36 -0600 (CST) From: Micheal Mc Evoy Subject: Before you respond with REMOVE (Was: W-EMED remove) In-reply-to: <20010227163552.29345.qmail@web1101.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk Replying to the List with REMOVE isn't going to stop the Spam. In fact most Remove replies are resold as valid addresses by Spammers. The Spam was sent to the listserv, not the individuals. Just my .02 ----- Micheal Mc Evoy voyageur@whitepine.com Swift Water Rescue Tech Wilderness EMT-B Travis County Search & Rescue Austin, Texas Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:53:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0KZT8B07S00I24H@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:53:07 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:52:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from sm10.texas.rr.com (sm10.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.222]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:52:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from connolly (cs2875-174.austin.rr.com [24.28.75.174]) by sm10.texas.rr.com (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f1R3kfQ06377 for ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 21:46:41 -0600 Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 21:52:32 -0600 (CST) From: Micheal Mc Evoy Subject: Re: W-EMED seasickness In-reply-to: <3A9ABE4E.686768DB@iegventure.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk On Mon, 26 Feb 2001, Frank Blair wrote: >I teach sailing at Hurricane Island Outward Bound School in small boats >off the coast of Maine. Looking at the horizon, taking the helm, and >caution on food provided help some. Lately I have been carrying raw >ginger, a little slice of which seems to help some people, though it may >be the placebo effect. In treatment I become very concerned about >dehydration. I carry some powdered Gatorade to assist in replenishing >electrolytes, though I use very little. I have found ginger works very well with my kids for car sickness, although we carry candied ginger instead of slices. >On a personal note, as a sailor since I was two, including five years in >the Navy, two years of which was at sea, I pretty much never get >seasick, but I puked my guts out (to use the technical term) in the >Drake Passage from the Falklands to the Antarctic peninsula. Last time I was seasick was going between Washinbgton Island and Rock Island (off the tip of the Door Penisula in Wisconsin), the seas were about 4 feet, pretty rough for a 10 year old Boy Scout in a 40 ft boat. Any other time I've been to sea it's been on an LHA or LHD. > >Frank Blair ----- Micheal Mc Evoy voyageur@whitepine.com Swift Water Rescue Tech Wilderness EMT-B Travis County Search & Rescue Austin, Texas Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 15:43:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0KKR3PJCE00HYEI@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 15:41:31 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 15:37:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from intelli.com ([216.52.140.2]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 15:37:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from iegventure.com (slip-32-103-39-226.il.us.prserv.net [32.103.39.226]) by intelli.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA12556 for ; Mon, 26 Feb 2001 14:34:34 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 14:36:31 -0600 From: Frank Blair Subject: Re: W-EMED seasickness Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A9ABE4E.686768DB@iegventure.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-Accept-Language: en,pdf References: Mike Webster wrote: > I am in information about different treatments for seasickness. I am > familar with some of the different OTC and Rx meds. such as > dimenhydrinate, meclizine, and scoplamine as well as using a herbal > remedy such as ginger. I understand that the main issue with > seasickness is dehydration although there are other S/Sx. I am also > interested in if anybody has any findings for the effectiveness of the > sea wristbands that use an acupunture technique. I know that using the > horizon as a fixed object point can be helpful at times. Preventative > measures are key as once an individual is seasick recovery can be > harder. Anyway, any other new or different approaches to treating and > avoiding seasickness would be most helpful. I work as the expedition > medic on a tour ship that crosses between Ushuaia, Argentina and the > Antarctic Peninsula across the Drake Passage so there is plenty of > opportunity for practice with all of our clients! Thanks, Mike > Webster I teach sailing at Hurricane Island Outward Bound School in small boats off the coast of Maine. Looking at the horizon, taking the helm, and caution on food provided help some. Lately I have been carrying raw ginger, a little slice of which seems to help some people, though it may be the placebo effect. In treatment I become very concerned about dehydration. I carry some powdered Gatorade to assist in replenishing electrolytes, though I use very little. One caution I would pass along is that the Scopolamine patches (which have gone in and out of availability) have the danger that the drug can be very painful if the patient gets any on his/her fingers and then rubs their eyes. On a personal note, as a sailor since I was two, including five years in the Navy, two years of which was at sea, I pretty much never get seasick, but I puked my guts out (to use the technical term) in the Drake Passage from the Falklands to the Antarctic peninsula. Frank Blair Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 15:39:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0HS3FPOPC009Y3M@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 15:39:07 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 15:38:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r11.mx.aol.com (imo-r11.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.65]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 15:38:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from Omikid@aol.com by imo-r11.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.f3.7c739ba (9823) for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 15:38:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 15:38:03 -0500 (EST) From: Omikid@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED seasickness Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 127 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk Not sure about seasickness, but I have seen reliefbands (SP) used with pretty good relief. (I believe they generate a weak pulsing electrical current to the proper area of the wrist that can be turned different levels depending on patient need) for post-op nausea with great success. take care, Omi Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:41:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0HLUPMH4S00I5B6@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:41:04 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:40:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f61.law7.hotmail.com [216.33.237.61]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:40:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 09:39:44 -0800 Received: from 200.47.18.247 by lw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 24 Feb 2001 17:39:44 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 10:39:44 -0700 From: Mike Webster Subject: W-EMED seasickness Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/html Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: [200.47.18.247] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Feb 2001 17:39:44.0598 (UTC) FILETIME=[C64BEF60:01C09E88]
Hi,
 
I am in information about different treatments for seasickness. I am familar with some of the different OTC and Rx meds. such as dimenhydrinate, meclizine, and scoplamine as well as using a herbal remedy such as ginger. I understand that the main issue with seasickness is dehydration although there are other S/Sx. I am also interested in if anybody has any findings for the effectiveness of the sea wristbands that use an acupunture technique. I know that using the horizon as a fixed object point can be helpful at times. Preventative measures are key as once an individual is seasick recovery can be harder. Anyway, any other new or different approaches to treating and avoiding seasickness would be most helpful. I  work as the expedition medic on a tour ship that crosses between Ushuaia, Argentina and the Antarctic Peninsula across the Drake Passage so there is plenty of opportunity for practice with all of our clients!
 
Thanks,   Mike Webster

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Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 11:43:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0G5KAUSCA00AVUV@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 11:43:45 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 11:43:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from web11207.mail.yahoo.com (web11207.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.131.189]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 11:43:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from [64.53.45.94] by web11207.mail.yahoo.com; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:43:17 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:43:17 -0800 (PST) From: Derrick Barcombe Subject: RE: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies In-reply-to: <856532CB07BED3118FE300204840E28A03A59200@vexwncc02.hurlburt.af.mil> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Cc: tkhyatt@davidson.cc.nc.us Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010223164317.10922.qmail@web11207.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk I recently purchased a new book titled "Field Guide to Wilderness Medicine" by Paul S. Auerbach, Howard J. Donner, and Eric A. Weiss. This is a very new topic of interest for, me so I am by no means an authority on the topic, I work as a paramedic, and volunteer for the local rescue squad, I have not had a chance to read the whole book but what I have browsed so far seems very interesting. Does any one have any comments about this book? Derrick --- Robert.Allen@hurlburt.af.mil wrote: > Last time I talked to Jim Wilkerson (about two > months ago) he was working on > the next edition of "Medicine for Mountaineering". > > > The 4th edition of Auerbach's textbook is now just > titled "Wilderness > Medicine". Got a copy at my office a couple of > weeks ago. 1910 pages, new > chapters on The Eye in the Wilderness, Pain > Management, Litters and Carries, > Jungle Travel and Survival, Cave Rescue, Bear > Attacks, Ethnobotany, Seasonal > Allergies, Wilderness Navagation, Ropes and > Knot-tying, Elders in the > Wilderness and others. Considerable revision in > many other chapters. Color > illustrations are now included throughout the text > instead of being grouped > in plates in the back. It's expensive, but I think > it's worth it (nope, no > financial interest: I get a freebie copy of the > book since I co-wrote one > of the chapters, but that's it.). > > Rob > > Robert C. Allen, DO, FACEP > Col(s), USAF MC FS > Group Surgeon > 720th Special Tactics Group (AFSOC) > 223 Cody Ave > Hurlburt Field, FL 32544-5309 > DSN 579-4243 > Comm 850-884-4243 > E-Mail: Robert.Allen@hurlburt.af.mil > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Steven D. Pirie [mailto:sdpirie@home.com] > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 5:04 AM > To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > Subject: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies > > > Frits, > > >Which book or books are relevant to this subject > (and others) and also > >which books can I still buy today? > > If I was to pick up one book (as a starting text) on > wilderness medicine it > would have to be Medicine for Mountaineering and > other wilderness > activities (4th edition) by Dr. J. A. Wilkerson. > Published in 1992 by > Mountaineers Books. ISBN 0898863317. Although it is > starting to date itself > it is still one of the best starting texts around. > (Anyone have information > on when we can expect a new edition?) > > I am sure that Dr. P. Auerbach's Wilderness Medicine > : Management of > Wilderness and Environmental Emergencies text has > some good information on > preventative medicine in the wilderness too but I > have been unable to > convince the office to pick up a copy yet, nor can > afford one on my own. > Has anyone picked up a copy yet? Is it worth > upgrading to the 4th edition > if you have the 3rd edition? (which someone [who I > am sure is on this list] > has borrowed and has not returned yet... hint, > hint.) > > With respect to a good wilderness preventative > medicine textbook, I am not > sure there is one around. When I look at infectious > diseases / preventive > medicine in the wilderness I use: > > - Some military field manuals that are not readily > accessible to non > military folk. > > - Hunter's Tropical Medicine and Emerging Infectious > Diseases 8th edition > (2000) > W B Saunders Co; ISBN: 0721662234 > > - Control of Communicable Diseases Manual 17th > edition (2000) American > Public Health Assn; ISBN: 087553242X > > - 2000 Red Book: Report of the Committee on > Infectious Diseases 25th > edition (2000) American Academy of Pediatrics; ISBN: > 1581100396 > > - Health Information for International Travel 1999 - > 2000 edition (also > known as the "Yellow Book") is a great book put out > by the Center for > Disease Control (US Government) an can be ordered > from the US Government > Printing Office (stock # 017-023-00202-3). You can > also find it online > somewhere at www.cdc.gov > > As for the short forms, EMed is Emergency Medicine, > EMS is Emergency > Medical Services and RN is Registered Nurse, you can > find a great list of > medical short forms at www.ncemi.org under the > Abbreviation Translator > link. (NCEMI is the short form for National Center > for Emergency Medicine > Informatics)r > > > Hope that helps, > > Steven > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE > General Duty Ward Officer - Military In-Patient Unit > Canadian Forces Support Unit Ottawa - Civic Hospital > Site > 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu ===== Derrick J. Barcombe "street Doc" Lexington N.C. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 09:36:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0G144FGZS00A9BC@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 09:36:11 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 09:35:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from shepherd.hurlburt.af.mil (shepherd.hurlburt.af.mil [151.166.15.65]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 09:35:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from shepherd.hurlburt.af.mil (root@localhost) by shepherd.hurlburt.af.mil with ESMTP id IAA29527 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:34:36 -0600 (CST) Received: from exwncc02.hurlburt.af.mil (exwncc02.hurlburt.af.mil [151.166.208.36]) by shepherd.hurlburt.af.mil with ESMTP id IAA29523 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:34:35 -0600 (CST) Received: by EXWNCC02 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:35:20 -0600 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:34:51 -0600 From: Robert.Allen@hurlburt.af.mil Subject: RE: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <856532CB07BED3118FE300204840E28A03A59200@vexwncc02.hurlburt.af.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk Last time I talked to Jim Wilkerson (about two months ago) he was working on the next edition of "Medicine for Mountaineering". The 4th edition of Auerbach's textbook is now just titled "Wilderness Medicine". Got a copy at my office a couple of weeks ago. 1910 pages, new chapters on The Eye in the Wilderness, Pain Management, Litters and Carries, Jungle Travel and Survival, Cave Rescue, Bear Attacks, Ethnobotany, Seasonal Allergies, Wilderness Navagation, Ropes and Knot-tying, Elders in the Wilderness and others. Considerable revision in many other chapters. Color illustrations are now included throughout the text instead of being grouped in plates in the back. It's expensive, but I think it's worth it (nope, no financial interest: I get a freebie copy of the book since I co-wrote one of the chapters, but that's it.). Rob Robert C. Allen, DO, FACEP Col(s), USAF MC FS Group Surgeon 720th Special Tactics Group (AFSOC) 223 Cody Ave Hurlburt Field, FL 32544-5309 DSN 579-4243 Comm 850-884-4243 E-Mail: Robert.Allen@hurlburt.af.mil -----Original Message----- From: Steven D. Pirie [mailto:sdpirie@home.com] Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 5:04 AM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies Frits, >Which book or books are relevant to this subject (and others) and also >which books can I still buy today? If I was to pick up one book (as a starting text) on wilderness medicine it would have to be Medicine for Mountaineering and other wilderness activities (4th edition) by Dr. J. A. Wilkerson. Published in 1992 by Mountaineers Books. ISBN 0898863317. Although it is starting to date itself it is still one of the best starting texts around. (Anyone have information on when we can expect a new edition?) I am sure that Dr. P. Auerbach's Wilderness Medicine : Management of Wilderness and Environmental Emergencies text has some good information on preventative medicine in the wilderness too but I have been unable to convince the office to pick up a copy yet, nor can afford one on my own. Has anyone picked up a copy yet? Is it worth upgrading to the 4th edition if you have the 3rd edition? (which someone [who I am sure is on this list] has borrowed and has not returned yet... hint, hint.) With respect to a good wilderness preventative medicine textbook, I am not sure there is one around. When I look at infectious diseases / preventive medicine in the wilderness I use: - Some military field manuals that are not readily accessible to non military folk. - Hunter's Tropical Medicine and Emerging Infectious Diseases 8th edition (2000) W B Saunders Co; ISBN: 0721662234 - Control of Communicable Diseases Manual 17th edition (2000) American Public Health Assn; ISBN: 087553242X - 2000 Red Book: Report of the Committee on Infectious Diseases 25th edition (2000) American Academy of Pediatrics; ISBN: 1581100396 - Health Information for International Travel 1999 - 2000 edition (also known as the "Yellow Book") is a great book put out by the Center for Disease Control (US Government) an can be ordered from the US Government Printing Office (stock # 017-023-00202-3). You can also find it online somewhere at www.cdc.gov As for the short forms, EMed is Emergency Medicine, EMS is Emergency Medical Services and RN is Registered Nurse, you can find a great list of medical short forms at www.ncemi.org under the Abbreviation Translator link. (NCEMI is the short form for National Center for Emergency Medicine Informatics)r Hope that helps, Steven ---------------------------------------------------------- Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE General Duty Ward Officer - Military In-Patient Unit Canadian Forces Support Unit Ottawa - Civic Hospital Site 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit ---------------------------------------------------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:44:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0FZALY2G4008PKB@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:44:08 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:43:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from sm10.texas.rr.com (sm10.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.222]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:43:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from connolly (cs2875-174.austin.rr.com [24.28.75.174]) by sm10.texas.rr.com (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f1NDcjQ25840 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:38:45 -0600 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:43:32 -0600 (CST) From: Micheal Mc Evoy Subject: Re: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies In-reply-to: <200102230846.f1N8kWW491275@smtp-server.nlr.nl> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk Frits, Several good books on Leave No Trace, which deals with things like handling of waste in wilderness areas, are: Soft Paths by Bruce Hampton & David Cole, Stackpole Books, 1995 Leave No Trace by Annette McGivney, The Mountaineers, 1998 As for Wilderness Medicine, I recommend the following: Wilderness Medicine(5ed), William Forgey,MD, The Globe Pequot Press, 2000 The Outward Bound Wilderness First-Aid Handbook, Jeffrey Issac, PA-C, The Lyons Press, 1998 A Comprehensive Guide to Wilderness and Travel Medicine, Eric A. Weiss, MD, Adventure Medical Kits, 1997 ----- Micheal Mc Evoy voyageur@whitepine.com Swift Water Rescue Tech Wilderness EMT-B Travis County Search & Rescue Austin, Texas Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:05:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0FTQLMCE400HCE9@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:05:14 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:04:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (femail3.rdc1.on.home.com [24.2.9.90]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:04:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from [24.114.181.130] by femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20010223110414.RCYY12119.femail3.rdc1.on.home.com@[24.114.181.130]> for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:04:14 -0800 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:04:16 -0800 From: "Steven D. Pirie" Subject: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies In-reply-to: <200102230846.f1N8kWW491275@smtp-server.nlr.nl> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: sdpirie@mail.slnt1.on.wave.home.com To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Precedence: bulk Frits, >Which book or books are relevant to this subject (and others) and also >which books can I still buy today? If I was to pick up one book (as a starting text) on wilderness medicine it would have to be Medicine for Mountaineering and other wilderness activities (4th edition) by Dr. J. A. Wilkerson. Published in 1992 by Mountaineers Books. ISBN 0898863317. Although it is starting to date itself it is still one of the best starting texts around. (Anyone have information on when we can expect a new edition?) I am sure that Dr. P. Auerbach's Wilderness Medicine : Management of Wilderness and Environmental Emergencies text has some good information on preventative medicine in the wilderness too but I have been unable to convince the office to pick up a copy yet, nor can afford one on my own. Has anyone picked up a copy yet? Is it worth upgrading to the 4th edition if you have the 3rd edition? (which someone [who I am sure is on this list] has borrowed and has not returned yet... hint, hint.) With respect to a good wilderness preventative medicine textbook, I am not sure there is one around. When I look at infectious diseases / preventive medicine in the wilderness I use: - Some military field manuals that are not readily accessible to non military folk. - Hunter's Tropical Medicine and Emerging Infectious Diseases 8th edition (2000) W B Saunders Co; ISBN: 0721662234 - Control of Communicable Diseases Manual 17th edition (2000) American Public Health Assn; ISBN: 087553242X - 2000 Red Book: Report of the Committee on Infectious Diseases 25th edition (2000) American Academy of Pediatrics; ISBN: 1581100396 - Health Information for International Travel 1999 - 2000 edition (also known as the "Yellow Book") is a great book put out by the Center for Disease Control (US Government) an can be ordered from the US Government Printing Office (stock # 017-023-00202-3). You can also find it online somewhere at www.cdc.gov As for the short forms, EMed is Emergency Medicine, EMS is Emergency Medical Services and RN is Registered Nurse, you can find a great list of medical short forms at www.ncemi.org under the Abbreviation Translator link. (NCEMI is the short form for National Center for Emergency Medicine Informatics)r Hope that helps, Steven ---------------------------------------------------------- Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE General Duty Ward Officer - Military In-Patient Unit Canadian Forces Support Unit Ottawa - Civic Hospital Site 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit ---------------------------------------------------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:05:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0FTQLZVTU00A9BC@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:05:14 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:05:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (femail3.rdc1.on.home.com [24.2.9.90]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 06:05:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from [24.114.181.130] by femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20010223110426.RDAN12119.femail3.rdc1.on.home.com@[24.114.181.130]> for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:04:26 -0800 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:04:27 -0800 From: "Steven D. Pirie" Subject: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies In-reply-to: <200102230846.f1N8kWW491275@smtp-server.nlr.nl> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: sdpirie@mail.slnt1.on.wave.home.com To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Precedence: bulk Frits, >Which book or books are relevant to this subject (and others) and also >which books can I still buy today? If I was to pick up one book (as a starting text) on wilderness medicine it would have to be Medicine for Mountaineering and other wilderness activities (4th edition) by Dr. J. A. Wilkerson. Published in 1992 by Mountaineers Books. ISBN 0898863317. Although it is starting to date itself it is still one of the best starting texts around. (Anyone have information on when we can expect a new edition?) I am sure that Dr. P. Auerbach's Wilderness Medicine : Management of Wilderness and Environmental Emergencies text has some good information on preventative medicine in the wilderness too but I have been unable to convince the office to pick up a copy yet, nor can afford one on my own. Has anyone picked up a copy yet? Is it worth upgrading to the 4th edition if you have the 3rd edition? (which someone [who I am sure is on this list] has borrowed and has not returned yet... hint, hint.) With respect to a good wilderness preventative medicine textbook, I am not sure there is one around. When I look at infectious diseases / preventive medicine in the wilderness I use: - Some military field manuals that are not readily accessible to non military folk. - Hunter's Tropical Medicine and Emerging Infectious Diseases 8th edition (2000) W B Saunders Co; ISBN: 0721662234 - Control of Communicable Diseases Manual 17th edition (2000) American Public Health Assn; ISBN: 087553242X - 2000 Red Book: Report of the Committee on Infectious Diseases 25th edition (2000) American Academy of Pediatrics; ISBN: 1581100396 - Health Information for International Travel 1999 - 2000 edition (also known as the "Yellow Book") is a great book put out by the Center for Disease Control (US Government) an can be ordered from the US Government Printing Office (stock # 017-023-00202-3). You can also find it online somewhere at www.cdc.gov As for the short forms, EMed is Emergency Medicine, EMS is Emergency Medical Services and RN is Registered Nurse, you can find a great list of medical short forms at www.ncemi.org under the Abbreviation Translator link. (NCEMI is the short form for National Center for Emergency Medicine Informatics)r Hope that helps, Steven ---------------------------------------------------------- Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE General Duty Ward Officer - Military In-Patient Unit Canadian Forces Support Unit Ottawa - Civic Hospital Site 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit ---------------------------------------------------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:49:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0FP0HB4FK00FA4J@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:49:38 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:47:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp-server.nlr.nl (spider.nlr.nl [137.17.80.200]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 03:47:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from fripcy.nlr.nl (fripcy.nlr.nl [137.17.228.92]) by smtp-server.nlr.nl (8.11.2/8.11.2/NLR 24/01/2001) with ESMTP id f1N8kWW491275; Fri, 23 Feb 2001 09:46:32 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 09:46:31 +0100 From: Frits van Doorn Subject: Re: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <200102230846.f1N8kWW491275@smtp-server.nlr.nl> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1154 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk Disclaimer: "The National Aerospace Laboratory NLR DOES NOT ACCEPT ANY FINANCIAL COMMITMENT derived from this message." Dear everybody, I don't know much what all those abbreviations mean like EMed, EMS, RN, BScN, UE, and undoubtedly, unless otherwise indicated, everybody is an expert, but I want to be sure and would like to read more in a book. Although I know that a book can be mistifying too. Which book or books are relevant to this subject (and others) and also which books can I still buy today? I thank you all for being helpfull. Frits van Doorn fvdoorn@nlr.nl the Netherlands --------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:41:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0EMZPSH2800HHB4@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:40:59 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:40:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from p2v-real.sfasu.edu (p2v-real.sfasu.edu [144.96.128.7]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:40:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from [144.96.241.96] (technology.education.sfasu.edu [144.96.241.96]) by SFAADM.SFASU.EDU (PMDF V6.0-24 #46514) with ESMTP id <01K0EKVNCMBY8WW2ZI@SFAADM.SFASU.EDU> for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:40:25 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:36:28 -0600 From: Robert Judy Subject: W-EMED Thanks to all Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: rjudy@sfaadm.sfasu.edu To: canoetx@world.std.com Cc: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Thanks to all of you have contributed to my education on this topic of proper methods of human body liquid waste elimination in natural aquatic settings and microbial content of same. I am greatly relieved to have learned how to relieve. The unanimous opinion is to go in the water and that the liquid is sterile with a few exceptions. The exceptions are in cases of infection which are not readily transmissible via the water body with a few exceptions which are not endemic to this continent. Thanks again! rmj Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:57:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0DYF4DJUU00GYCN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:57:10 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:56:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (femail3.rdc1.on.home.com [24.2.9.90]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:56:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from [24.114.181.130] by femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with ESMTP id <20010222025622.PRIR12119.femail3.rdc1.on.home.com@[24.114.181.130]> for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 18:56:22 -0800 Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 18:56:24 -0800 From: "Steven D. Pirie" Subject: W-EMED Urination in wilderness water bodies In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: sdpirie@mail.slnt1.on.wave.home.com To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Precedence: bulk Hello, >Several people mentioned "peeing in the river" which I objected to >and stated that urine carried "bad bugs" but other people are stating >that urine is sterile and that wilderness organizations recommend >"peeing in the river." I am going to take a shot at this, from a purely microbiological (not chemical nor good form) point of few. In the healthy human urine is sterile. In some survival medicine texts (United Kingdom) it has even been recommended that urine can be used, when there is a lack of clean water, for wound irrigation in a bind. If the human is a carrier for "bad bugs" this can change. I am not sure that bacteria from a urinary tract infection would change the eco-course of the water environment, but who knows as I am not an ecologist. Nor, if you treat your water properly are the bacteria from a UTI going to cause any grief. One "bad bug" that IS bad news is the bacteria that causes schistosomiasis. It works like this. A person who has schistosomiasis urinates in the water. This urine contains eggs of Schistomsoma haematobium. These eggs then hatch in the water and the larvae make there way into a fresh water snail. After a few weeks the cercariae come out from the snail and penetrate the human skin (while you are wading about, swimming, bathing or working) and make the way to the blood steam where they are carrier throughout the body and the cycle starts over. The good news is that schistosomiasis is not indigenous to North America (thank God). I cannot think, off the top of my head, of any other bacteria that urine is the mode of transmission that would cause you problems. If anyone else can think of any I would be interested in your post. One last thought, urine (especially in still standing water) can attract flies which are a vector for numerous problems. This again is not a big North American problem, but I thought is worth mentioning. Now on a "good form" point of from my hiking buddy (who is not medical, but rather a recreational user of the outdoors). "Geez, don't pee in the water, I gotta get my water from there! Bugs or not in your urine it is just gross". Hope that helps, take care, Steven ------------------------------------------------------------- Lt. Steven D. Pirie, RN, BScN, UE General Duty Ward Officer - Military In-Patient Unit Canadian Forces Support Unit Ottawa - Civic Hospital Site 2 Health Support Operational Training Unit ------------------------------------------------------------- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:54:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0DW8WW3UA00GYCN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:54:54 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:51:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from picusnet.com (mail.picusnet.com [207.7.90.2]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:51:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from default [207.7.95.15] by picusnet.com (SMTPD32-6.05) id A0AFDB5009E; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:51:43 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:51:53 -0600 From: GATORDOC Subject: Re: W-EMED urination in wilderness water bodies Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000f01c09c7a$6acdf6c0$0f5f07cf@default> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: I vote for peeing in the river. It is true that urine is sterile, and I can't imagine that a group could put enough urine in a river to have a measurable effect. As for pooping in the river, that's a different story. Robert E. Stambaugh, M.D. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Judy" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 2:51 PM Subject: W-EMED urination in wilderness water bodies > I have been a "lurker" on this list for about two years, it is very > interesting and I have learned much. > > > I have no EMed training really but I am a paddler and a discussion > list we have for paddle topics turned to portable toilets and such. > > Several people mentioned "peeing in the river" which I objected to > and stated that urine carried "bad bugs" but other people are stating > that urine is sterile and that wilderness organizations recommend > "peeing in the river." > > Y'all are Doctors and educated people and stuff what is this lists > opinion? I don't mind being wrong since it means I am learning, I > just don't want to learn wrong facts. Hey, I remember when the Am. > Red Cross taught tourniquets and incisions at snake bites, things > change. > > So what is the story on river peeing and urine sterility, in this > groups opinion? > > Pee in the water > Pee away from the river > mixed opinion > > Thanks in advance, > > rmj > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:44:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0DXY1LYLG00AACW@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:44:11 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:41:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from server3.safepages.com (server3.safepages.com [216.127.146.5]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:41:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from [64.24.134.152] (03-152.073.popsite.net [64.24.134.152]) by server3.safepages.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D18D325507 for ; Thu, 22 Feb 2001 02:29:19 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:29:07 -0600 From: Kayak & Custom Adventures Worldwide Subject: Re: W-EMED urination in wilderness water bodies In-reply-to: <000f01c09c7a$6acdf6c0$0f5f07cf@default> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Precedence: bulk References: <000f01c09c7a$6acdf6c0$0f5f07cf@default> National Park Service *Requires* that urination be in the river, not on the ground for groups traveling the Colorado River. Where this protocol is not followed there are long lasting, smelly, unsightly salt stains from human urine. We use the ocean for waste disposal for similar reasons on our coastal kayaking trips in Alaska. Two flushes a day... keeps the high beach clean for camping and berry picking. Jim -- ......................................................... Jim Vermillion Sea Kayaking Master Guide / Guide Instructor Alaskan Kayaks Kayak & Custom Adventures Worldwide www.kayakAK.com Kenai Fjords National Park, Prince William Sound, The Aleutian Islands Thailand, Hawaii Coastal Kayaking Instruction and Guided Tours by Sea Kayak Winter Address: 19042 Baidarka Street Chugiak, AK 99567 USA Summer Address: PO Box 2249 Seward, AK 99664 USA Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:56:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0DLTDOTY200GYCN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:56:49 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:55:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from p3-real.sfasu.edu (p3-real.sfasu.edu [144.96.128.8]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:55:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from [144.96.241.96] (technology.education.sfasu.edu [144.96.241.96]) by SFAADM.SFASU.EDU (PMDF V6.0-24 #46514) with ESMTP id <01K0DJNXAC8S8WW1BR@SFAADM.SFASU.EDU> for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:55:10 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:51:19 -0600 From: Robert Judy Subject: W-EMED urination in wilderness water bodies Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: rjudy@sfaadm.sfasu.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk I have been a "lurker" on this list for about two years, it is very interesting and I have learned much. I have no EMed training really but I am a paddler and a discussion list we have for paddle topics turned to portable toilets and such. Several people mentioned "peeing in the river" which I objected to and stated that urine carried "bad bugs" but other people are stating that urine is sterile and that wilderness organizations recommend "peeing in the river." Y'all are Doctors and educated people and stuff what is this lists opinion? I don't mind being wrong since it means I am learning, I just don't want to learn wrong facts. Hey, I remember when the Am. Red Cross taught tourniquets and incisions at snake bites, things change. So what is the story on river peeing and urine sterility, in this groups opinion? Pee in the water Pee away from the river mixed opinion Thanks in advance, rmj Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 16:42:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K02H02QX7M00FTMC@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 16:39:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 16:39:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from cc-ent.com (p114.cb0.harborside.com [204.214.112.114]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 16:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from Spooler by cc-ent.com (Mercury/32 v3.21c) ID MO0000CA; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:36:44 -0800 Received: from spooler by cc-ent.com (Mercury/32 v3.21c); Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:36:24 -0800 Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:36:12 -0800 From: Liz Marr Subject: Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM In-reply-to: <3A890C88.4679.60220F4@localhost> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: kconover@pitt.edu Cc: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A89384C.22971.1A14F81E@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk References: <3A86A3E0.26077.1022CF91@localhost> I "moderate" seven lists with memberships from 200 to 1200 members - mostly hosted on Listserv software. All new members are on review for their first few posts by system default. After it appears that they are not "spammers" then I turn them loose. For most of the lists, I don't "moderate" or really read content at all, just check to make sure it isn't spam or bugged. If they don't post, they are on review indefinitely (or until I do a blanket command to catch the rest). Listserv has a setting that a list of members can be seen only by the list owners, so that is what I use to prevent someone from logging on and getting names to sell or spam. No spam, no "moderating" of anything posted (but sometimes a bit of a delay until I get the messages of the new folks reviewed ) is seen on my lists for the most part. In all, I probably get 20MB of email per day including lists I own, lists I'm on, business and personal correspondence. It takes a full half-hour to hour to quickly hit the important stuff, the rest I read at leisure. Compare to some of the lists I'm on, W-EMED doesn't have so much traffic that I think anyone would even notice a delay as long as it is less than a day, if it meant not haven't any spam. On 13 Feb 2001, at 10:29, Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP wrote: > I suppose, that if you or some other > well-known and respected person were to volunteer to serve as > moderator, we could set it up as a moderated list . . . . are you > volunteering, Liz? Sort of joking, but also seriously. > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:52:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K02B5I867U00FTLH@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:52:32 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:52:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail3.uts.ohio-state.edu (mail3.uts.ohio-state.edu [128.146.214.32]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:52:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from page (ts6-5.homenet.ohio-state.edu [140.254.112.108]) by mail3.uts.ohio-state.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA01122 for ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:51:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 13:51:53 -0500 (EST) From: John Page Subject: Re: W-EMED Wilderness herbal and plant medicine Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: page.95@pop.service.ohio-state.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <200102131851.NAA01122@mail3.uts.ohio-state.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Precedence: bulk Maybe I can help a bit - You asked: >I should be greatly pleased to get in contact to all these colleagues in order to gather >information, reseach on it and prepare it for common uses. I been doing doing research on wilderness medicine herbs via Native American, current nutritional research, & Chinese medicine/herbs... I would be happy to help out if I can be of service - please let me know the specifics of your need. I am also a wilderness medicine 1st responder - covering rural (juncle +) adventures, trips to China, high altitude rocks, Antarctica, skydiving events, mushroom clubs, etc... Let me know - I am SOMETIMES around - John Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:59:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K0253MRDNS00FTLH@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:59:13 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:59:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from inago.swcp.com (inago.swcp.com [198.59.115.17]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:58:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (tanman@localhost) by inago.swcp.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA03716 for ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 08:56:01 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 08:56:01 -0700 (MST) From: TANMAN Subject: Re: W-EMED Wilderness herbal and plant medicine In-reply-to: <3A885F22.4E850F55@lohmueller-arzt.de> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: inago.swcp.com: tanman owned process doing -bs See the book Edible and Medicinal Plants of the Great Lakes by Thomas A. Naegele, DO It is forsale over Amazon.com Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email Albuquerque, New Mexico __________________________________________________________________ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:31:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K02455NWLQ009N5W@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:31:28 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:30:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron ("port 3427"@[136.142.23.9]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K02435ES8A009B8P@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu> for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:29:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 10:29:28 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM In-reply-to: <3A86A3E0.26077.1022CF91@localhost> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: Liz Marr , wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A890C88.4679.60220F4@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk References: Filtering out spam is a function of the moderator -- for a moderated list. The W-EMED list is an unmoderated list -- there is no censoring or moderation. As soon as a message is posted, it goes out to the list. Having a moderated list requires a moderator who reviews each and every message. It filters out spam and offtopic messages -- but at the cost of making the list less spontaneous, and closing the list when the moderator isn't available (as I'm not available much of the time). I suppose, that if you or some other well-known and respected person were to volunteer to serve as moderator, we could set it up as a moderated list . . . . are you volunteering, Liz? Sort of joking, but also seriously. On 11 Feb 2001, at 14:38, Liz Marr wrote: > Filtering out spam is a function of the moderator - not the list. It > is NOT that hard to set up a list so that new subscribers are set to > review and some other steps (like protecting the member list) to help > prevent it. And nearly all list serving software around can be > configured this way if the moderator so desires. As for Yahoo - I > hate their groups. I use an email program (by choice) that does not > "do" HTML or RTF. I can't turn OFF that type of programming on the > Yahoo lists. Every third or forth message has it, gaudy colors and > links. And a small semantic - LISTSERV is a brand name, copyrighted > and so on, of a particular type of software (and it is very, very easy > to configure to get rid of spam) The proper term is "list server" > when meaning the software to service discussion lists. > > On 10 Feb 2001, at 17:05, Craig Button wrote: > > > ANy thoughts on moving the list to something like egroup(now yahoo > > groups). They seem do do a better job of filtering out the spam. > > > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) > To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 12 Feb 2001 17:09:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K013Q2LWAA00FDR9@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 12 Feb 2001 17:09:15 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 12 Feb 2001 17:08:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from dinklage1.i3-service.de (root@[212.172.220.102]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2001 17:08:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from lohmueller-arzt.de (B7ee6.pppool.de [213.7.126.230]) by dinklage1.i3-service.de (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA07678; Mon, 12 Feb 2001 23:09:53 +0100 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 23:09:38 +0100 From: Wolfgang Lohmueller Subject: W-EMED Wilderness herbal and plant medicine Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A885F22.4E850F55@lohmueller-arzt.de> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [de] (WinNT; I) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_VMIgT4TwTl3yz19HgGNPkA)" Precedence: bulk X-Accept-Language: en,de,fr,it,pt References: <20010211025749.77608.qmail@web9603.mail.yahoo.com> Dies ist eine mehrteilige Nachricht im MIME-Format. --Boundary_(ID_VMIgT4TwTl3yz19HgGNPkA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hello All, I am new on this list and want to greet you all. Probably I just arrived at a moment the point of interest more seem to be spam instead of wilderness emergency medicine, but I am hopefully there are enough themes about wilderness and emergency and medicine :-). My main interests on this list are: in the wilderness you will find probably local herbs with powerfull medical potential - if and only if you know them and understand their actions. Therefore my question: Who is engaged / involved with wilderness herbal and plant medicine? I suppose that available plants probably also can be used in emergency cases (if no definite other appropriate ressources are available). I should be greatly pleased to get in contact to all these colleagues in order to gather information, reseach on it and prepare it for common uses. If my question is OT in this list, please send eMails directly to me. Thanks in advance Wolfgang Lohmueller, Bremerhaven, Germany --Boundary_(ID_VMIgT4TwTl3yz19HgGNPkA) Content-type: text/x-vcard; name=info.vcf; charset=iso-8859-2 Content-description: Visitenkarte für Wolfgang Lohmueller Content-disposition: attachment; filename=info.vcf Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT begin:vcard n:Lohmueller;Wolfgang tel;cell:+49 179 39 37 336 tel;fax:+49 471 47460 tel;home:+49 471 40929 tel;work:+49 471 44848 x-mozilla-html:TRUE url:http://www.lohmueller-arzt.de org:Praktischer Arzt;Naturheilverfahren (Natural therapy) adr:;;Auerstr. 50;Bremerhaven;Bremen;27574;Germany version:2.1 email;internet:info@lohmueller-arzt.de title:Diplom-Physiker, DTM (Dipl.Tropical Medicine) note:System Analysis fn:Wolfgang Lohmueller end:vcard --Boundary_(ID_VMIgT4TwTl3yz19HgGNPkA)-- -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 17:45:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZQPPXNWA00EZ7K@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 17:45:34 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 17:43:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from cc-ent.com (p73.cb0.harborside.com [204.214.112.73]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 17:43:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from Spooler by cc-ent.com (Mercury/32 v3.21c) ID MO00009F; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 14:40:12 -0800 Received: from spooler by cc-ent.com (Mercury/32 v3.21c); Sun, 11 Feb 2001 14:38:42 -0800 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 14:38:24 -0800 From: Liz Marr Subject: Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A86A3E0.26077.1022CF91@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Filtering out spam is a function of the moderator - not the list. It is NOT that hard to set up a list so that new subscribers are set to review and some other steps (like protecting the member list) to help prevent it. And nearly all list serving software around can be configured this way if the moderator so desires. As for Yahoo - I hate their groups. I use an email program (by choice) that does not "do" HTML or RTF. I can't turn OFF that type of programming on the Yahoo lists. Every third or forth message has it, gaudy colors and links. And a small semantic - LISTSERV is a brand name, copyrighted and so on, of a particular type of software (and it is very, very easy to configure to get rid of spam) The proper term is "list server" when meaning the software to service discussion lists. On 10 Feb 2001, at 17:05, Craig Button wrote: > ANy thoughts on moving the list to something like egroup(now yahoo groups). > They seem do do a better job of filtering out the spam. Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 16:13:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZNH4R8DU00929V@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 16:13:08 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 16:10:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from web2.po.com (web2.po.com [204.178.220.34]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 16:10:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from www@localhost) by web2.po.com (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) id QAA21771; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 16:07:19 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 16:07:19 -0500 (EST) From: Charles Werntz Subject: W-EMED Hypothermia-Related Deaths, NY & US, MMWR/00-02-02, Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <200102112107.QAA21771@web2.po.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="-------981925409POLAAA08vM4p" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: web2.po.com: www set sender to cwerntz@pol.net using -f ---------981925409POLAAA08vM4p Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is an article from last weeks MMWR pertaining to hypothermia, and particularly hypothermia deaths. I thought some on this list might find this interesting as it sheds some light on that which we are trying to prevent. Carl Werntz, D.O. Mountaineer Area Rescue Group ------------------ Forward Header -------------------- Originally From: "Charles Werntz" Subject: Fwd: [OEM] MMWR/00-02-02, Hypothermia-Related Deaths, NY & US Date: 02/09/2001 04:48pm ---------981925409POLAAA08vM4p Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Charles Werntz" To: Subject: Fwd: [OEM] MMWR/00-02-02, Hypothermia-Related Deaths, NY & US Date: 02/09/2001 04:48pm Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=_1D46AEB9.F796D03E" This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_1D46AEB9.F796D03E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline =20 --=_1D46AEB9.F796D03E Content-Type: message/rfc822 Received: from SMTP (hscnavmail.hsc.wvu.edu [10.2.2.201]) by gateway.hsc.wvu.edu; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 15:05:28 -0500 Received: from mailhub.hsc.wvu.edu ([10.2.2.200]) by 10.2.2.201 (Norton AntiVirus for Internet Email Gateways 1.0) ; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 19:26:58 0000 (GMT) Received: from durin.mc.duke.edu (durin.mc.duke.edu [152.3.78.41]) by mailhub.hsc.wvu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA22930; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 14:22:51 -0500 Received: from list (list.mc.duke.edu [152.3.171.222]) by durin.mc.duke.edu (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f13HVoO11890; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 12:31:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from LIST.MC.DUKE.EDU by LIST.MC.DUKE.EDU (LISTSERV-TCP/IP release 1.8d) with spool id 3797513 for OCC-ENV-MED-L@LIST.MC.DUKE.EDU; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 12:28:14 -0500 Received: from Duke.edu ([66.26.51.79]) by mail8.nc.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.537.53); Sat, 3 Feb 2001 12:28:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en,fr MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Message-ID: <3A7C4069.65F7500A@Duke.edu> Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 12:31:21 -0500 Reply-To: Gary Greenberg Sender: Occupational & Environmental Medicine for Clinicians & Public Health Professionals From: Gary Greenberg Subject: [OEM] MMWR/00-02-02, Hypothermia-Related Deaths, NY & US To: OCC-ENV-MED-L@LIST.MC.DUKE.EDU Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by mailhub.hsc.wvu.edu id OAA22930 February 02, 2001 / 50(04);53-7 http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5004a1.htm Hypothermia-Related Deaths --- Suffolk County, New York, January 1999--March 2000, and United States, 1979--1998 Hypothermia is the unintentional lowering of core body temperature to <95 F (<35 C) (1). Core body temperature normally is maintained at 97.7 F (36.5 C) (2). Most hypothermia-related deaths occur during the winter in states that have moderate to severe cold temperatures (e.g., Alaska, Illinois, New York, and Pennsylvania) (3). During 1979--1998, New York had the second highest number of hypothermia-related deaths in the United States. This report presents case reports of four hypothermia-related deaths during January 1999--March 2000 in Suffolk County (1999 population: 1,383,847), the largest county in New York excluding New York City, and summarizes hypothermia-related deaths in the United States during 1979--1998. Such deaths can be prevented by educating health-care providers and the public to identify persons at risk for hypothermia. Case Reports Case 1. On December 15, 1998, an 89-year-old woman with a history of wandering was noticed missing from the adult home facility where she resided and was found shivering in 1 foot of water at the edge of a pond on the property. The temperature that day ranged from 23 F--54 F (--5 C--12.2 C). On admission to a hospital, her rectal temperature was 95 F (35 C). Her medical history included dementia, multiple transient ischemic attacks (TIAs), hypertension, and chronic atrial fibrillation. Her medications included digoxin, furosemide, aspirin, colchicine, and sertraline hydrochloride. On December 21, she developed adult respiratory distress syndrome; she died on January 10, 1999. The death certificate listed the cause of death as complications of environmental exposure with aspiration. Hypertension, arteriosclerotic cardiovascular disease, and dementia were contributory. Case 2. In January 2000, a 51-year-old man wearing a rain- soaked sweater, pants, and work boots was found dead behind a dumpster. On the day he was found, the temperature ranged from 25 F--49 F (--3.9 C--9.4 C); the day before, it had been raining with temperatures in the 50s. Drug paraphernalia was found in his pockets and needle track marks were observed on his arms. According to the police report, the decedent had a history of illegal drug use. Toxicology showed 0.10% ethanol, morphine, codeine, and methadone in his body. The death certificate listed the cause of death as complications of acute and chronic drug abuse and environmental hypothermia. Case 3. In January 2000, a 79-year-old woman who resided in an adult home facility had been missing for 40 minutes. She was found outside, unresponsive, wearing a blouse, sweatshirt, and sweatpants. The temperature that day ranged from 26 F--32 F (--3.3 C--0 C). At a hospital, her rectal temperature was 81 F (27 C). She was treated with hypothermic blankets but died 1 hour later. The decedent had a history of senile dementia, syncope, and TIAs. Her medications included iron sulfate and aspirin. The cause of death was hypothermia with senile dementia and arteriosclerotic cardiovascular disease contributing. Case 4. In March 2000, a 45-year-old homeless man was found dead next to a makeshift bed in a wooded campsite with his shirt partly covered with snow. The temperature that day ranged from 24 F--41 F (--4.4 C--4 C). He was fully clothed, including hat and gloves, and was lying partially in a sleeping bag on top of a canvass pool cover. The decedent had a history of alcohol and drug abuse, but no drugs or alcohol were found in his blood. He had been living in the woods for several years and was last seen several weeks before his death. The death certificate listed the cause of death as probable hypothermia attributed to environmental exposure with chronic alcoholism contributing. New York During 1979--1998, the age-adjusted death rate for hypothermia was 0.2 per 100,000 population (International Classification of Diseases, Ninth Revision [ICD-9], codes E901.0, E901.8, and E901.9; excludes man-made cold [E901.1])*, compared with the median of 0.4 for the United States. Suffolk County ranked fifth among New York's 62 counties in number of hypothermia-related deaths for persons of all ages. Age-specific death rates in Suffolk County and New York increased with age (Figure 1). Of all hypothermia- related deaths in New York and Suffolk County, 386 (53%; 95% confidence interval [CI]=3D=B13.6%) and 25 (58%; 95% CI=3D=B114= .8%), respectively, occurred among persons aged >65 years. In Suffolk County, age-adjusted death rates were three times higher for men than women. United States During 1979--1998, 13,970 persons died from hypothermia, an average of 699 deaths per year (range: 420--1024 deaths) (Figure 2), and the age-adjusted death rates for hypothermia decreased significantly (p<0.001). Of all hypothermia- related deaths, 6857 (49%; 95% CI=3D=B10.8= 3%) occurred among persons aged >65 years. The age-adjusted rate for hypothermia was approximately 2.5 times higher for men (0.5 per 100,000 population) than women (0.2) during the same period. Reported by: CV Wetli, MD, Office of the Medical Examiner, Dept of Health Svcs, Suffolk County, Hauppauge; P Smith, MD, State Epidemiologist, New York State Dept of Health. Health Studies Br, Div of Environmental Hazards and Health Effects, National Center for Environmental Health; and an EIS Officer, CDC. Editorial Note: The findings in this report indicate that hypothermia- related deaths in the United States decreased during 1979-- 1998. In addition, in New York and Suffolk County, hypothermia-related death rates increased by age category and were higher among men, similar to trends observed in the United States. All four case-patients in this report had one or more risk factors for hypothermia-related death (e.g., older age [>65 years], lack of adequate housing, homelessness, mental impairment, drug overdose, and alcohol ingestion) (4). Contributing factors include malnutrition, lack of fitness, severe illness, and drug use or abuse (5). Data in this report are limited by the underreporting of hypothermia in medical records and death certificates (5). Hypothermia-related deaths may be underreported because 1) physical signs of hypothermia may not be recognized; 2) hospitals may not use low-temperature thermometers; 3) medical personnel may be unaware of hypothermia's significance; and 4) an autopsy cannot prove hypothermia as an underlying cause of death (6). In addition, vital record data on hypothermia may not code hypothermia as the underlying cause of death. Mortality estimates are 75%--90% for persons with hypothermia and underlying disease, compared with <10% for those with hypothermia alone (7). Diseases such as hypoglycemia, hypothyroidism, sepsis, and cirrhosis, or drug use (e.g., alcohol, phenothiazines, opiates, clonidine, lithium, barbiturates, and benzodiazepenes) can result in decreased heat production (8). Alcohol use results in central nervous system depression, vasodilation, and blunting behavioral responses to cold. Signs of hypothermia include uncontrollable shivering, confusion, memory loss, drowsiness, exhaustion, fumbling hands, and slurred speech. Severe hypothermia can result in loss of consciousness, apparent apnea, or undetectable pulse. In infants, warning signs of hypothermia include cold, bright red skin and lethargy. Preventive measures include wearing several layers of loosely fitting clothing with a tightly woven, wind- resistant outer layer and wool, silk, or polypropylene inner layers to hold body heat. In cold and windy climates, persons should maintain dry clothing; eat well-balanced meals; drink warm, sweet, nonalcoholic beverages; and avoid exertion because excess perspiration can cause chilling (9). Persons who participate in outdoor recreation should take appropriate precautions, such as wearing wet suits while participating in water-related activities or carrying emergency shelters and heat-generating devices for unexpected weather changes while hiking or camping. During winter months or in areas with low nighttime temperatures, blankets or extra clothing should be kept in vehicles when driving. Measures to prevent hypothermia-related deaths include educating the public and health-care providers (e.g., emergency department, adult home facility, and social services staff) to identify persons at risk and establishing outreach programs that provide warm shelter and adequate clothing. References 1. Petersdorf RG. Hypothermia and hyperthermia. In: Wilson JD, Braunwald E, Isselbacher KJ, et al, eds. Harrison's principles of internal medicine. 12th ed. New York, New York: McGraw-Hill, 1991:2198--200. 2. Yoder E. Disorders due to heat and cold. In: Bennet JC, Plum F, eds. Cecil textbook of medicine. Philadelphia, Pennsylvania: WB Saunders Company, 1996:501--3. 3. CDC. Hypothermia-related deaths---Georgia, January 1996-- December 1997, and United States, 1979--1995. MMWR 1998;47:1037--40. 4. Abramowicz M, ed. Treatment of hypothermia. In: The Medical Letter on Drugs and Therapeutics. New Rochelle, New York: The Medical Letter on Drugs and Therapeutics, December 1994. 5. Hector MG. Treatment of accidental hypothermia. Am Fam Physician 1992;45:785--92. 6. CDC. Hypothermia---United States. MMWR 1983;32:46--8. 7. Vassallo SU, Delaney KA. Thermoregulatory principles. In: Goldfrank LR, Flomenbau NE, eds. Goldfrank's toxicologic emergencies. 6th ed. Stamford, Connecticut: Appleton and Lange, 1998:285--95. 8. Fauci AS, Isselbacher KJ, Wilson JD, eds. Harrison's principles of internal medicine. 14th ed. New York, New York: McGraw-Hill, 1999:210--2. 9. CDC. Extreme cold: a prevention guide to promote your personal health and safety. Atlanta, Georgia: US Department of Health and Human Services, CDC, 1996. * These data were obtained from the Compressed Mortality File (CMF), maintained by CDC's National Center for Health Statistics, and have been prepared in accordance with the external cause-of-death codes from the ICD-9. The CMF contains information from death certificates filed in the 50 states and the District of Columbia. FIGURE 1. Rate* of hypothermia-related deaths, by age group =97 Suffolk County, New York, New York, and United States, 1979=961998 http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/figures/m004a1f1.gi f FIGURE 2. Number of hypothermia-related deaths, by year =97 United States= , 1979=961998 http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/figures/m004a1f2.gif -- Gary N. Greenberg, MD MPH Sysop / Moderator Occ-Env-Med-L MailList gary.greenberg@duke.edu Duke Occupat, Environ, Int & Fam Medicine OEM-L Maillist Website: http://occhealthnews.com 8<---8<- Please remove this footer before replying! ->8-->8 The Occ-Env-Med-L maillist broadcasts messages to the world of profession= als in Occupational & Environmental Medicine. Our 2,820 participants include clinicians, public health experts and hygiene and safety professionals from 60 nations. For questions, contact Gary Greenberg, MD at Gary.Greenberg@Duke.Edu ****Ongoing & unfettered support for this electronic forum is provided by= :**** Lymerix Vaccine by SmithKline Beecham http://www.lymerix.com Protect employees at-risk for Lyme Disease. A significant advance in Lyme= Disease Prevention. For forum introduction & rules of conduct, http://occhealthnews.com See http://archive.occhealthnews.com for: - Search or browse OEM-L's archives - Subscription Management (eg. subscribe, unsubscribe, digest options) --=_1D46AEB9.F796D03E-- ---------981925409POLAAA08vM4p-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 13:49:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZIGYY7G400FMXQ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 13:49:26 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 13:47:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta-1.gci.net (mta-1.gci.net [208.138.130.82]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 13:47:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mmp-1.gci.net ([208.138.130.80]) by mta-1.gci.net (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15) with ESMTP id G8LW6G01.K5I for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:47:04 -0900 Received: from [24.237.59.245] ([24.237.59.245]) by mmp-1.gci.net (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15) with ESMTP id G8LW6G02.N08; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:47:04 -0900 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:46:34 -0900 From: Ken Zafren Subject: W-EMED Re: [erncrc] Fw: KYEM cave rescue regulation changes you - input welcome In-reply-to: <3A86555B.3293.8D01154@localhost> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: kconover@pitt.edu, sar-l@lists.islandnet.com, wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu, mra@altadena.net, doug@karstsports.com, Art and Pam Dodds Cc: "'Robert Duncan'" , "'ERNCRC'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Nitrile gloves are now becoming the standard. They are non-allergenic, stronger than latex and proven on rescues as well as in the Emergency department. A good pair of nitrile gloves has all the desirable handling characteristics of latex without any of the disadvantages. Ken -- Ken Zafren, MD, FACEP Chairman, Medical Committee of the Mountain Rescue Association US Representative - Commission for Mountain Emergency Medicine (ICAR MedCom) home address: 10181 Curvi St. Anchorage, AK 99516 USA zafren@alaska.com tel 1.907.346.2333 fax 1.907.346.4445 on 2/11/01 5:03 AM, Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP at kconover@pitt.edu wrote: > On 9 Feb 2001, at 22:49, Art and Pam Dodds wrote: > > [Reference: response to the new proposed Kentucky cave rescue > team required equipment list from the state government and the > gloves listed on it, cross-posted to sar-l, mra and w-emed lists as it's > an interesting topic. Suspect there are _many_ strong opinions > about gloves!] > >> One silly comment about Latex Gloves. Persons are now allergic to >> latex or the powder they are packed in. Vinyl may not have the feel >> of latex, but will not dissolve in gas or oil and will not decompose >> in your pack. > > On the other hand, the vinyl gloves rip much more easily, and don't > stretch as much -- they don't fit as well as a result, and often there > are little floppy bits hanging off the end that get caught in stuff and > make delicate work very hard. I'm mildly allergic to latex gloves' > powder, but as I spend half my working day in gloves, I almost > always wear the latex ones and then just wash the powder off my > hands inbetween uses. I do a full surgical scrub at the end of the > day to get all the powder off my hands and from under my nails. It > also helps remove all the "cooties" that may have jumped onto my > hands during a day in the ED -- influenza and cold virus particles, > nasty bacteria that cause diarrhea, that sort of stuff. > > If you need a really good pair of latex gloves for fine work, use the > sterile ones. They're far superior in construction, stretch, and fit, > even to the unsterile latex exam gloves. If I have to do fine work with > glove protection, even if unsterile, or if I want to make sure that my > gloves don't rip (i.e, doing a pelvic exam on someone with > gonorrhea) I'll wear the sterile gloves. > > --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP > http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover > sent with Pegasus high-security email > download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:24:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZDEK1N26009969@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:24:43 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:22:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.clarityconnect.com (smtp.clarityconnect.com [206.64.143.9]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:22:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.clarityconnect.com (206.64.143.5) by smtp.clarityconnect.com with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 3.0b8) ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:26:27 -0500 Received: from HotCelery.InternetSmiths.com (209.150.235.205) by mail.clarityconnect.com with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 3.0.2) ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:25:35 -0500 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 11:22:31 -0500 From: Nigel Dyson-Hudson Subject: check out smartgroups.com Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM In-reply-to: <3A864DEC.13791.8B2D3F3@localhost> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu X-Sender: (Unverified) To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Cc: Craig Button Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5.0.2.1.2.20010211110334.01d6cec0@pop3.lightlink.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Precedence: bulk References: craig & others, smartgroups.com is used by Northern NJ Grotto and a couple of other caving groups. They also have the choice of closed or open list, a calender, an archive, a place to upload photos and other features. When it comes to spam, I just hit Ctrl D and ignore which address the spam was directed to. nigel (As you can see from above, with the current WEMSI list I don't have to wonder about which e-mail address I am sending from.) At 08:31 AM 2/11/01 -0500, Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP wrote: >Yes, but most of these insist on adding spam to the bottom of >_every_ message. Is that better or worse? They certainly have >some other advantages. > >On 10 Feb 2001, at 17:05, Craig Button wrote: > > > ANy thoughts on moving the list to something like egroup(now yahoo > > groups). They seem do do a better job of filtering out the spam. > > _________________________________________________________________ Get > > your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > > wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) > > To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: > > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > >--Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP > http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover > sent with Pegasus high-security email > download free from www.pmail.com >Do not reproduce without author's express permission. >To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" >as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu >Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu nigel dyson-hudson, InternetSmiths, ndh@InternetSmiths.com "mad dogs and Englishmen" and I am both! Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZAYLKS3Y00912X@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:14:35 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:13:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from sm5.texas.rr.com (sm5.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.219]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:13:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from connolly (cs2875-174.austin.rr.com [24.28.75.174]) by sm5.texas.rr.com (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f1BFBXe00818 for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:11:33 -0600 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:13:12 -0600 (CST) From: Micheal Mc Evoy Subject: Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM In-reply-to: <3A864DEC.13791.8B2D3F3@localhost> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk I'm on five different lists, 3 are not yahoo groups, and participate in several USENET groups. I get far more spam in my regular email than I do from the lists and USENET combined. I much prefer listserv, majordomo, etc over yahoo for the same reason Keith posted, the insipid little spams at the bottom of each post. ----- Micheal Mc Evoy voyageur@whitepine.com Swift Water Rescue Tech Wilderness EMT-B Travis County Search & Rescue Austin, Texas On Sun, 11 Feb 2001, Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP wrote: >Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:31:40 -0500 >From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" >Reply-To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu >To: Craig Button >Cc: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu >Subject: Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM > >Yes, but most of these insist on adding spam to the bottom of >_every_ message. Is that better or worse? They certainly have >some other advantages. > >On 10 Feb 2001, at 17:05, Craig Button wrote: > >> ANy thoughts on moving the list to something like egroup(now yahoo >> groups). They seem do do a better job of filtering out the spam. >> _________________________________________________________________ Get >> your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com >> >> Do not reproduce without author's express permission. >> To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe >> wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) >> To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: >> wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > >--Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP > http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover > sent with Pegasus high-security email > download free from www.pmail.com >Do not reproduce without author's express permission. >To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" >as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu >Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:03:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZAK91Y760098KV@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:03:01 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:01:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f77.law3.hotmail.com [209.185.241.77]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:01:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 07:00:53 -0800 Received: from 24.185.71.118 by lw3fd.law3.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 15:00:52 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:00:52 -0500 From: Fabrice Czarnecki Subject: Re: W-EMED Re: [erncrc] Fw: KYEM cave rescue regulation changes you - input welcome Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: [24.185.71.118] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2001 15:00:53.0130 (UTC) FILETIME=[6DBA96A0:01C0943B] How about nitrile gloves? They are supposed to be more resistant and chemical proof than latex. Fabrice Czarnecki, M.D. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:05:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZ8JOB1D6008YW9@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:05:17 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:03:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from gtei2.bellatlantic.net (gtei2.bellatlantic.net [199.45.40.146]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:03:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from Laptop (client-141-151-171-139.bellatlantic.net [141.151.171.139]) by gtei2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA24406; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:03:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 09:03:23 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: W-EMED Re: [erncrc] Fw: KYEM cave rescue regulation changes you - input welcome In-reply-to: <3A84BA47.7905FC6C@meer.net> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: sar-l@lists.islandnet.com, wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu, mra@altadena.net, doug@karstsports.com, Art and Pam Dodds Cc: "'Robert Duncan'" , "'ERNCRC'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A86555B.3293.8D01154@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk On 9 Feb 2001, at 22:49, Art and Pam Dodds wrote: [Reference: response to the new proposed Kentucky cave rescue team required equipment list from the state government and the gloves listed on it, cross-posted to sar-l, mra and w-emed lists as it's an interesting topic. Suspect there are _many_ strong opinions about gloves!] > One silly comment about Latex Gloves. Persons are now allergic to > latex or the powder they are packed in. Vinyl may not have the feel > of latex, but will not dissolve in gas or oil and will not decompose > in your pack. On the other hand, the vinyl gloves rip much more easily, and don't stretch as much -- they don't fit as well as a result, and often there are little floppy bits hanging off the end that get caught in stuff and make delicate work very hard. I'm mildly allergic to latex gloves' powder, but as I spend half my working day in gloves, I almost always wear the latex ones and then just wash the powder off my hands inbetween uses. I do a full surgical scrub at the end of the day to get all the powder off my hands and from under my nails. It also helps remove all the "cooties" that may have jumped onto my hands during a day in the ED -- influenza and cold virus particles, nasty bacteria that cause diarrhea, that sort of stuff. If you need a really good pair of latex gloves for fine work, use the sterile ones. They're far superior in construction, stretch, and fit, even to the unsterile latex exam gloves. If I have to do fine work with glove protection, even if unsterile, or if I want to make sure that my gloves don't rip (i.e, doing a pelvic exam on someone with gonorrhea) I'll wear the sterile gloves. --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:34:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZZ7G1APXU00EZ7K@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:34:07 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:31:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from gtei1.bellatlantic.net (gtei1.bellatlantic.net [199.45.40.145]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:31:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from Laptop (client-141-151-171-139.bellatlantic.net [141.151.171.139]) by gtei1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA20033; Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:31:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:31:40 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: Re: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: Craig Button Cc: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3A864DEC.13791.8B2D3F3@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Yes, but most of these insist on adding spam to the bottom of _every_ message. Is that better or worse? They certainly have some other advantages. On 10 Feb 2001, at 17:05, Craig Button wrote: > ANy thoughts on moving the list to something like egroup(now yahoo > groups). They seem do do a better job of filtering out the spam. > _________________________________________________________________ Get > your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) > To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:10:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZYB75JXM4008J7N@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:10:41 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:10:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f238.law7.hotmail.com [216.33.237.238]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:10:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 14:10:01 -0800 Received: from 65.2.23.29 by lw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 22:10:01 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:10:01 -0500 From: Craig Button Subject: W-EMED Palms and WEMS Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: [65.2.23.29] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2001 22:10:01.0621 (UTC) FILETIME=[369CC450:01C093AE] It's been a few months since the last Palm and wems posting. Anyone have anything new to add to those posts. The USAF is now testing them for their indepentent duty technicians and their expeditionary forces. I've caried mine with me everywere I've gone and find it invaluable for reference and documtation purposes. I've even been able to beam information to flight crews when the've come to pick up my patients. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:08:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZYB3VUG6C008VG7@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:08:03 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f43.law7.hotmail.com [216.33.237.43]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:06:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 14:05:55 -0800 Received: from 65.2.23.29 by lw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 10 Feb 2001 22:05:55 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 17:05:55 -0500 From: Craig Button Subject: W-EMED Listserve and SPAM Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: [65.2.23.29] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2001 22:05:55.0431 (UTC) FILETIME=[A3DF2770:01C093AD] ANy thoughts on moving the list to something like egroup(now yahoo groups). They seem do do a better job of filtering out the spam. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Thu, 8 Feb 2001 10:42:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZV52PZYMM0094SP@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Thu, 8 Feb 2001 10:42:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Thu, 08 Feb 2001 10:42:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from web11203.mail.yahoo.com (web11203.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.131.185]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Thu, 08 Feb 2001 10:42:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from [204.244.68.5] by web11203.mail.yahoo.com; Thu, 08 Feb 2001 07:42:13 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2001 07:42:13 -0800 (PST) From: joe vipond Subject: Re: W-EMED Raynaud's_Syndrome In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010208154213.78118.qmail@web11203.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk medication wise, there's some good evidence that the calcium channel blockers (nifedipine, amlodipine, felodipine) taken prior to exposure to cold is effective. as a sufferer myself, I certainly appreciate them as they have allowed me to continue playing in the outdoors in the winter... Dr. Joe Vipond __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 7 Feb 2001 22:48:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZUG5IFMW6008GWY@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 7 Feb 2001 22:48:58 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 07 Feb 2001 22:48:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (oe70.law8.hotmail.com [216.33.240.205]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 07 Feb 2001 22:48:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 07 Feb 2001 19:47:30 -0800 Date: Wed, 07 Feb 2001 22:47:33 -0500 From: Jonathan Silver Subject: W-EMED =?iso-8859-1?Q?Raynaud's_Syndrome?= Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: Organization: Appalachian Mountain Club MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: [63.25.170.224] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2001 03:47:30.0002 (UTC) FILETIME=[DC594320:01C09181] Hi all, If memory serves (And it often doesn't!), a therapy for Raynaud's Syndrome was once discussed on this list. It involved soaking the hands in water at various temperatures for various lengths of time. I'd appreciate any information anyone might have. Thanks, Jonathan Silver, WEMT Bloomfield, NJ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:26:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZHQKDPU7A00B990@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:27:00 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:25:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mclean.mail.mindspring.net (mclean.mail.mindspring.net [207.69.200.57]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:25:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from smui02.slb.mindspring.net (smui02.slb.mindspring.net [199.174.114.25]) by mclean.mail.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA20695 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:25:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by smui02.slb.mindspring.net id UAA0000005299; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:25:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:25:06 -0500 From: cheazlit@ix.netcom.com Subject: W-EMED Hawaii Stretcher Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: Precedence: bulk X-Originating-IP: 192.31.86.34 Hi All, I now have a basket stretcher for my class!! Thanks to all for your help and suggestions. Mahalo! Cindy Heazlit cheazlit@ix.netcom.com Instructor, National Cave Rescue Commission Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:33:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZHIFFHK6Q00B990@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:33:56 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:33:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com (imo-d02.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.34]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:33:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from Caverbru@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.c3.d6c102f (26121) for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:32:22 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:32:21 -0500 (EST) From: Caverbru@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Need Ferno in Hawaii for class Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 130 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk Cindy, Has anyone checked with the NPS folks at Volcano NP? What about the Coast Guard or any of the military bases? I'm in Pittsburgh and don't have any direct contact but those would seem like good places to start and some of those folks might be interested in the class. Bru Randall Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:24:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZGGDGB80C005PLY@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:24:17 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:23:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-d05.mx.aol.com (imo-d05.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.37]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:23:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from Kathrynpark@cs.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.25.10950aaa (4426) for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:22:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:22:57 -0500 (EST) From: Kathrynpark@cs.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Need Ferno in Hawaii for class Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <25.10950aaa.27a63c11@cs.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 352 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_25.10950aaa.27a63c11_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_25.10950aaa.27a63c11_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cindy, Have you tried contacting a local fire dept in Hawaii that also has a rescue team? I would be really suprised if there weren't a number of Fernos already there, so you wouldn't need to ship them. There is also a model that comes in two halves to make it able to be packed into remote areas. I think I saw it in Searchgear.com. Have a GREAT trip! Kathryn Park, WEMT, SAR --part1_25.10950aaa.27a63c11_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cindy,  
   Have you tried contacting  a local fire dept in Hawaii that also has a
rescue team?  I would be really suprised if there weren't  a number of Fernos
already there, so you wouldn't need to ship them.  There is also a model that
comes in two halves to make it able to be packed into remote areas.   I think
I saw it in Searchgear.com.  Have a GREAT trip!
   Kathryn Park, WEMT, SAR --part1_25.10950aaa.27a63c11_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:51:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZGB0ZSA7S00B7AG@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:51:28 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:50:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:50:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from sji-ca7-93.ix.netcom.com (sji-ca7-93.ix.netcom.com [209.109.235.93]) by smtp6.mindspring.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA12214 for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:50:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:50:34 -0500 (EST) From: cheazlit@ix.netcom.com Subject: W-EMED Need Ferno in Hawaii for class Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <200112816538141@ix.netcom.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Netcomplete v4.0, from NETCOM On-Line Communications, Inc. Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk Hi All, I had previously posted on this list about a Orientation to Cave Rescue class that I'm coordinating in Hawaii. I really appreciate the help I recieved in response to hyperthermic caving conditions and evacuations. Now I have another problem that I'd like some help with, I'm afraid. I've been having a really tough time tracking down a Ferno-Washington model 71 basket stretcher (or similar) for the class to use. I'm flying in most of the other specialized equipment, but the Ferno is a little too big to ship or put on the airplane. Does anyone know anyone I can contact to secure the use of a basket stretcher? We would most likely be using the stretcher for outside practice sessions and for part of the mock rescue. I can teach the class with just a SKED, but would like the students to become familiar with using a ferno too. They handle so very differently! I am willing to trade a slot in the class for use of the stretcher. Any help or advice would be appreciated. The class is on February 10-11. Thanks, Cindy Heazlit Instructor, National Cave Rescue Commission cheazlit@ix.netcom.com http://home.netcom.com/~cheazlit/ocr http://www.caves.org/io/ncrc Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:38:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZ7KA3A7DY0056NA@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:38:59 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:36:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.memlane.com (mail.memlane.com [199.185.225.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:36:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from name ([199.185.225.165]) by mail.memlane.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-55152U3000L300S0V35) with SMTP id com for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:36:05 -0700 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:30:48 -0700 From: Donovan Hoggan Subject: W-EMED Journals or other OGT Resources Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000f01c084a1$768b0fc0$a5e1b9c7@name> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01C08466.C4DE2F80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: <008801c083c2$eb3cd360$d76c9ec2@hppav> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C08466.C4DE2F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello all, I am the First-Aid Coordinator for a small SAR team in Alberta. We = received some funding for on-going training, but our original plan fell = through. My back-up was to use the grant to subscribe to a w-emed = journal or to buy some textbooks. Any suggestions? Our team is the = US-equivalent of the First Responder level. Thanks=20 Donovan Hoggan SEASAR ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C08466.C4DE2F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello all,
 
I am the First-Aid Coordinator for a = small SAR=20 team in Alberta.  We received some funding for on-going training, = but our=20 original plan fell through.  My back-up was to use the grant to = subscribe=20 to a w-emed journal or to buy some textbooks.  Any = suggestions?  Our=20 team is the US-equivalent of the First Responder = level.
 
Thanks
Donovan Hoggan
SEASAR
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C08466.C4DE2F80-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZ6ADUWPPG009RA9@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:44:54 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from inago.swcp.com (inago.swcp.com [198.59.115.17]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:44:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (tanman@localhost) by inago.swcp.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18592 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 13:43:25 -0700 (MST) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 13:43:25 -0700 (MST) From: TANMAN Subject: Re: W-EMED Rectal fluids In-reply-to: <008801c083c2$eb3cd360$d76c9ec2@hppav> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: inago.swcp.com: tanman owned process doing -bs On Sun, 21 Jan 2001, Fabrice Czarnecki wrote: > Could you give me any reference on rectal fluids? I searched Medline without success. > > What types of fluids should be used in severe dehydration? Saline? > > Fabrice Czarnecki, M.D. > Pick up a book on parenteral feeding. I have one at home, but am on the road now. They go thru the history of using different fluid mixtures for enema feedings, as one of our presidents was on rectal feeds for months and survived. Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email Albuquerque, New Mexico __________________________________________________________________ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:00:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZ60FOPHO8005H3U@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:00:02 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 10:58:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from front4m.grolier.fr (front4m.grolier.fr [195.36.216.54]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 10:58:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hppav (nas25-83.vlt.club-internet.fr [195.36.224.83]) by front4m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with SMTP id QAA25818 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 16:54:41 +0100 (MET) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 16:56:12 +0100 From: Fabrice Czarnecki Subject: W-EMED Rectal fluids Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <008801c083c2$eb3cd360$d76c9ec2@hppav> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0064_01C083CB.0F8D6BA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk C'est un message de format MIME en plusieurs parties. ------=_NextPart_000_0064_01C083CB.0F8D6BA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Could you give me any reference on rectal fluids? I searched Medline = without success. What types of fluids should be used in severe dehydration? Saline? Fabrice Czarnecki, M.D. ------=_NextPart_000_0064_01C083CB.0F8D6BA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Could you give me any reference on = rectal fluids? I=20 searched Medline without success.
What types of fluids should be used in = severe=20 dehydration? Saline?
 
Fabrice Czarnecki, = M.D.
------=_NextPart_000_0064_01C083CB.0F8D6BA0-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JZ0D2OAUYK008FU7@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:57:25 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:56:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from inago.swcp.com (inago.swcp.com [198.59.115.17]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:56:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (tanman@localhost) by inago.swcp.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA07695 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 07:55:49 -0700 (MST) Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 07:55:49 -0700 (MST) From: TANMAN Subject: W-EMED Torch Making In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: inago.swcp.com: tanman owned process doing -bs Anyone involved with making torches for light in the tropics? What materials are used? How long can one torch last? Thanks Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email Albuquerque, New Mexico __________________________________________________________________ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 22:11:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYN3SHACX0006ZDE@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 22:11:35 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r19.mail.aol.com (imo-r19.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.73]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from RescueRayS@aol.com by imo-r19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v28.35.) id h.87.53b243c (4211) for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:07 -0500 (EST) From: RescueRayS@aol.com Subject: W-EMED Vacuum cleaner Link Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <87.53b243c.278a8953@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 352 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Link for man with vacuum aol://4344:30.L100UCBM.357751.663242142 Raymond A. Schleif, MMSc., CIC, IT, NRAEMT-T Director of Clinical Studies Sisters of Charity Medical Centers, EMS Programs Training Institute for Medical Emergencies & Rescue --part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Link for man with vacuum

aol://4344:30.L100UCBM.357751.663242142


Raymond A. Schleif, MMSc., CIC, IT, NRAEMT-T
Director of Clinical Studies
Sisters of Charity Medical Centers, EMS Programs
Training Institute for Medical Emergencies & Rescue
--part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 22:11:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYN3SHACX0006ZDE@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 22:11:35 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r19.mail.aol.com (imo-r19.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.73]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from RescueRayS@aol.com by imo-r19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v28.35.) id h.87.53b243c (4211) for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 22:09:07 -0500 (EST) From: RescueRayS@aol.com Subject: W-EMED Vacuum cleaner Link Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <87.53b243c.278a8953@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 352 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Link for man with vacuum aol://4344:30.L100UCBM.357751.663242142 Raymond A. Schleif, MMSc., CIC, IT, NRAEMT-T Director of Clinical Studies Sisters of Charity Medical Centers, EMS Programs Training Institute for Medical Emergencies & Rescue --part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Link for man with vacuum

aol://4344:30.L100UCBM.357751.663242142


Raymond A. Schleif, MMSc., CIC, IT, NRAEMT-T
Director of Clinical Studies
Sisters of Charity Medical Centers, EMS Programs
Training Institute for Medical Emergencies & Rescue
--part1_87.53b243c.278a8953_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 17:06:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYMT55LJ84003XZ5@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 17:06:27 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 17:06:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from sm10.texas.rr.com (sm10.texas.rr.com [24.93.35.222]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 17:06:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from connolly (cs2875-16.austin.rr.com [24.28.75.16]) by sm10.texas.rr.com (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f07LvJQ28962 for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:57:19 -0600 Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 16:06:22 -0600 (CST) From: Micheal Mc Evoy Subject: Re: W-EMED Vacuum cleaner saves choking Japanese man In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu id RAA11875 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Precedence: bulk Could you resend it as a URL that is useable from any web browser ? Thanks. -- Micheal Mc Evoy voyageur@whitepine.com WFR/Ground Tracker/Swiftwater Rescue Tech Travis County Search and Rescue On Sun, 7 Jan 2001 JadedMedic@aol.com wrote: >Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:22:04 EST >From: JadedMedic@aol.com >Reply-To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu >To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu >Subject: W-EMED Vacuum cleaner saves choking Japanese man > > >Hi, > >This drifted into my inbox and I thought I'd pass it on. > >Best, > >Jay > >Click here:  01/06: AOL News: Vacuum Saves Choking Japanese Man > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 16:51:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYMSMOPMYI003NB3@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 16:51:34 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 16:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r11.mail.aol.com (imo-r11.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.65]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 16:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from JadedMedic@aol.com by imo-r11.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v28.35.) id h.cd.b0743b (3984) for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 16:50:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 16:50:33 -0500 (EST) From: JadedMedic@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Vacuum cleaner (try # 2) Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 171 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_cd.b0743b.278a3ea9_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_cd.b0743b.278a3ea9_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi again, As a few folks have helpfully pointed out, the hyperlink works only for other AOL users. Here's the story. Regards to all, Jay xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Vacuum Saves Choking Japanese Man .c The Associated Press TOKYO (AP) - A Japanese man choking on a sticky, glutinous rice cake was saved when his daughter sucked the glob out with a vacuum cleaner, an official said Saturday. Local fire station official Toshiyuki Matsuura said the 70-year-old man from northern Japan suddenly began gasping for air Tuesday as he chewed on a piece of ``mochi,'' a food traditionally eaten by the Japanese around New Year's. Family members first tried unsuccessfully to remove the food with their fingers. Then his daughter, 46, grabbed a vacuum cleaner, took out the man's dentures, and stuck the hose into his mouth with the switch turned to ``high.'' The gooey, white mass slowly emerged, and the man, whose name was not disclosed, had almost fully recovered by the time paramedics arrived, Matsuura said. ``A vacuum cleaner could be useful in an emergency like that, but I wouldn't recommend it to everyone because it's tricky,'' Matsuura said. ``He was rather lucky.'' Mochi is one of the most widely recognized symbols of the New Year in Japan, when many homes and shrines are decorated with ritual offerings of hardened blocks of rice. The blocks can become chewy and sticky when cooked. Every year, a handful of mostly elderly Japanese die after choking on mochi rice cakes, which are usually served grilled and wrapped in seaweed or in a broth. AP-NY-01-06-01 0455EST --part1_cd.b0743b.278a3ea9_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi again,

As a few folks have helpfully pointed out, the hyperlink works only for other
AOL users.  Here's the story.

Regards to all,

Jay

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


Vacuum Saves Choking Japanese Man

.c The Associated Press


TOKYO (AP) - A Japanese man choking on a sticky, glutinous rice cake was
saved when his daughter sucked the glob out with a vacuum cleaner, an
official said Saturday.

Local fire station official Toshiyuki Matsuura said the 70-year-old man from
northern Japan suddenly began gasping for air Tuesday as he chewed on a piece
of ``mochi,'' a food traditionally eaten by the Japanese around New Year's.

Family members first tried unsuccessfully to remove the food with their
fingers. Then his daughter, 46, grabbed a vacuum cleaner, took out the man's
dentures, and stuck the hose into his mouth with the switch turned to
``high.''

The gooey, white mass slowly emerged, and the man, whose name was not
disclosed, had almost fully recovered by the time paramedics arrived,
Matsuura said.

``A vacuum cleaner could be useful in an emergency like that, but I wouldn't
recommend it to everyone because it's tricky,'' Matsuura said. ``He was
rather lucky.''

Mochi is one of the most widely recognized symbols of the New Year in Japan,
when many homes and shrines are decorated with ritual offerings of hardened
blocks of rice.

The blocks can become chewy and sticky when cooked. Every year, a handful of
mostly elderly Japanese die after choking on mochi rice cakes, which are
usually served grilled and wrapped in seaweed or in a broth.

AP-NY-01-06-01 0455EST
--part1_cd.b0743b.278a3ea9_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:23:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYMPK20EE0003OTY@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:23:56 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:22:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r14.mail.aol.com (imo-r14.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.68]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:22:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from JadedMedic@aol.com by imo-r14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v28.35.) id h.b1.5713112 (9762) for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:22:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:22:04 -0500 (EST) From: JadedMedic@aol.com Subject: W-EMED Vacuum cleaner saves choking Japanese man Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 171 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_b1.5713112.278a29ec_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_b1.5713112.278a29ec_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, This drifted into my inbox and I thought I'd pass it on. Best, Jay Click here: =A001/06: A= OL News: Vacuum Saves Choking Japanese Man=20 --part1_b1.5713112.278a29ec_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

This drifted into my inbox and I thought I'd pass it on.

Best,

Jay

Click h= ere: =A001/06: AOL News: Vacuum Saves Choking Japanese Man --part1_b1.5713112.278a29ec_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 15:15:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYH44L2RFC003DU2@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 15:15:49 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 15:15:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp4.mail.yahoo.com (smtp4.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.69.101]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 15:15:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo028.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.226) by smtp.mail.vip.suc.yahoo.com with SMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 20:15:23 +0000 Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:14:37 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED Palm Pilot SAR Resources In-reply-to: <00ae01c075b9$b84e1b60$87417bd5@default> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <00a401c075c1$cbc076e0$c36bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A1_01C0758F.810D9CE0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A1_01C0758F.810D9CE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit if possible please send this info to the list, or to me privately. I would really like to have this info also. Any other Emergency Service products would be nice to have also. Thank you. Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P myoung@midwestpaging.com for alphanumeric pages. t heonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address My ICQ Number is 13139183. The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. -Joseph Heller "If you're going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." --George Orwell-- -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of Daryl Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 13:16 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: W-EMED Palm Pilot SAR Resources New Year Greetings to all. Some time ago, somebody posted details of SAR Resources available for the Palm Pilot. Could I request if anyone knows of suitable downloadable resources both for Land & Sea SAR, would they be kind enough to direct me to the relevant site(s). Many thanks & Take Care. Daryl J Wight Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu ------=_NextPart_000_00A1_01C0758F.810D9CE0 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; name="Richard Young.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Richard Young.vcf" BEGIN:VCARD VERSION:2.1 N:Young;Richard FN:Richard Young ORG:St.=A0John's=A0EMS-Dallas=A0County TITLE:Paramedic NOTE:13139183 1rst icq number TEL;WORK;VOICE:+1 (417) 345-2831 TEL;HOME;VOICE:4173452831 TEL;CELL;VOICE:+1 (417) 531-8059 TEL;PAGER;VOICE:+1 (800) 753-2259 ADR;WORK:;;P.O. Box 241;Buffalo;MO;65622-9463;United States of America LABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:P.O. Box 241=3D0D=3D0ABuffalo, MO = 65622-9463=3D0D=3D0AUnited States of America ADR;HOME:;;P.O. Box 241;Buffalo;MO;65622 LABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:P.O. Box 241=3D0D=3D0ABuffalo, MO = 65622 X-WAB-GENDER:2 BDAY:19741210 EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com EMAIL;INTERNET:myoung@midwestpaging.com REV:20001205T052710Z END:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_00A1_01C0758F.810D9CE0-- _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 14:22:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01JYH293APS40064DU@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 14:22:11 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:18:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from scooby.lineone.net (doggy.lineone.net [194.75.152.224]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:18:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from default (host213-123-52-196.dialup.lineone.co.uk [213.123.52.196] (may be forged)) by scooby.lineone.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA09356 for ; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 19:18:06 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 19:16:08 +0000 From: Daryl Subject: W-EMED Palm Pilot SAR Resources Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <00ae01c075b9$b84e1b60$87417bd5@default> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk New Year Greetings to all. Some time ago, somebody posted details of SAR Resources available for the Palm Pilot. Could I request if anyone knows of suitable downloadable resources both for Land & Sea SAR, would they be kind enough to direct me to the relevant site(s). Many thanks & Take Care. Daryl J Wight Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End --